Is Nihilism The Only Sane Political Ideology? (No Ideology!) - Tree of Souls - An Avatar Community Forum
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Old 05-02-2010, 02:39 AM
Tsyal Makto's Avatar
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Default Is Nihilism The Only Sane Political Ideology? (No Ideology!)

Lately, maybe through observation, or maybe through over-indulging in Fight Club, I'm being drawn toward political nihilism. Everyday in the world it is the same old debates between right vs center vs left. FOX/CNN vs MSNBC, Rush Limbaugh vs Ed Schultz, Church vs State, etc. These debates never seem to get anywhere, because I keep noticing in the same things.

- Lefties believe their system works the best, and present proof of it.
- Moderates believe their system is best, and they too present proof.
- Righties do the same.

Like on the issue of climate change, one will present scientific proof that climate change is happening, while another will provide scientifc proof that it is not happening.

So who's right? They all claim to be, and all seem to present proof of it. Who's think-tank do we trust?

- The lefty presents proof that their think-tank is most trustworthy.
- The moderate does the same.
- The righty does the same.

Obviously we have a problem here. How can all systems be correct if they contradict each other? They all provide evidence that their own works while the others do not, and all will defend the validity of said evidence using even more evidence confirming the source is trustworthy.

In the words of Geroge Carlin -

"Somebody's wasting their ****ing time. Could it be everyone?”

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"Man, I see in fight club the strongest and smartest men who've ever lived. I see all this potential, and I see squandering. God damn it, an entire generation pumping gas, waiting tables; slaves with white collars. Advertising has us chasing cars and clothes, working jobs we hate so we can buy **** we don't need. We're the middle children of history, man. No purpose or place. We have no Great War. No Great Depression. Our Great War's a spiritual war... our Great Depression is our lives. We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars. But we won't. And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off." - Tyler Durden

Last edited by Tsyal Makto; 05-02-2010 at 02:48 AM.
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Old 05-02-2010, 02:49 AM
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The answer to that question is what escapes *all* politicians of past, present and future. There can be no uniting school of thought for the entirety of the human race, our very nature is against that unfortunately. You suggest nihilism? But how can an idea of nothing be beneficial to today's society? You cannot go into Politics without an ideology unless everyone else does the exact same. The fact of the matter is that everyone has an agenda and they will always have an agenda.
You ask what is best. I cannot say, I am too inexperienced in the world of Politics. But perhaps that is what's needed, a fresh, young mind free of corruption and the idea of 'playing the political game'

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Old 05-02-2010, 04:41 PM
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Tsyal Makto, you have pointed out the silly situation that we find ourselves in. I know, its VERY tiresome. I used to be into politics. Actually, to me it comes in seasons and sometimes every four years. My father loves talking politics and watching the news, etc so growing up, these sort of discussions took place. My parents are mostly of the conservative stripe. My mother definitely is while my dad tries to look at all sides. He would get into phases. Sometimes he would listen to talk radio (Limbaugh, Savage, etc) and then he would stop because they were spewing crap. Then he would get into watching C-SPAN and reading the NY Times a lot, etc to get a different view.

I have don't pretty much the same thing. I rejected some of the "conservative" beliefs that the right has and I embraced some of the beliefs of the left. However, during the seasons (aka every 2 and 4 years in the US) I end up getting it a "righty" phase. In fact, I was in such a silly phase until I watched Avatar. LOL, thank you Avatar it got me out of that stupid phase and now I can honestly say I am sick of it. I am very, very tired of the political seesaw.

My father pointed out that no one is actually talking to each other. They yell. They throw temper tantrums, call each other names, etc. In fact, these ideologues are no different than some kids on the playground making fun of each other and then getting into fights.

What is needed is balance. The right have some good views. The left has some good views. The so-called moderates have some good views.

I want to scream at them and tell all of these people to sit down and behave like adults. Work things out.

Climate change is a real problem. Of course that is only one aspect of the problem we are facing environmentally. Pollution, deforestation, increased acidfication of the oceans, depletion of resources are all problems that everyone on both sides should be concerned about.

This is true in other areas as well. It seems that everyone has lost the ability to reason and to respect their opponents. Instead, you here lots of silly name calling and demonization of the other side.

I agree that political nihilism isn't the way to go. I understand why someone would go in that direction. Sometimes you just want to throw up your hands and give up but that in the long run, isn't the best way.
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Old 05-02-2010, 05:37 PM
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This is exactly why nobody is right. The only real way is a balance, at least politically. The leftists are all wrong. So are the rightwingers.
The difficulty is finding the right point.
For other things, people should do their own thing, as long as they don't try to impose it on others or harm others in the name of something they follow.
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Old 05-04-2010, 06:54 PM
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In a few words:

Politicians act in accordance to both facts and ideologies.
Ideologies are books that interpret reality from a point of view. Facts are tangible pieces of reality.
The problem is that most of them live in accordance to books instead of making their own postures from reality.
And also that the information given from reality is controlled by the media (TV, Internet, newspaper,...)
So, politics are f*cking damn difficult because nobody cares about facts and rather discuss what to do repeating over and over again what their books say.

Just a few words. I hope that made sense.
I love Plato, but I love Truth more - Aristotle
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Old 05-05-2010, 03:04 AM
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While I believe the majority of people do not grasp the political concepts they push, there are some very bright people in pretty much all areas of the political spectrum.

For example, most people support equality. It's a "feel-good" term. How can you not support equality? But not everyone agrees what equality is. Does equality mean that two people have an equal chance to succeed in this life? Does it mean that the law/government treats two people the same?

Someone from a liberal perspective might push the former interpretation of equality. That we should have an equal chance to succeed. Things like being born to a wealthy family versus a poor family ruin this type of equality. Too much of one's destiny is based on circumstances beyond ones own control. To "fix" this, we might do things like put a higher tax on the wealthy or on investment income. Or offer special programs designed to help the less fortunate.

Those obviously have weaknesses as well. You might be giving money to the less fortunate who are in that condition because of their own laziness, not unfortunate circumstance. You might tax someone who is wealthy because they work hard, not because they inherited millions.

So someone from a more conservative political view might say the equality we need is equal treatment from the government. This could support ideas like a flat income tax (or perhaps a sales tax.) They would oppose special programs like welfare because that is the government specifically treating people different.

Who's right? I don't believe there is a right answer. It's a bit like asking whether vanilla or chocolate ice cream is better.

But again, I believe the majority of people don't even understand the political concepts they push. That's ultimately what leads to passing laws that just make no sense and fail to achieve anyone's goals.
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