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  #1  
Old 12-12-2010, 12:27 AM
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Default Love vs. Lust

I've seen alot of meida expressing lustful feelings, and I just look at most at it as destroying the meaning of bueaty and love.

I know that for a fact that alot of people here just adore Neytiri and occasonaly give a one line and one of these:

But some of these coments bother me sometimes because they go alittle too far in the nessisary Inuendo. One example was when I wrote about the extended mating scene when I saw the SE, some people were writing about if Jake was having dirty thoughts before the connetion. I disturbed me because it just spoils the feeling of deep emotion and love.

When I was drawing my first Fan art of the Na'vi women with the blue flute, she was nude. But I didn't have the feeling of overwhelming lust when I was looking creating her. I was creating her because I was compeled by physical bueaty like when Jack drew Rose in Titanic. Don't get me wrong, I do have occasional feelings of lust but I'm working hard to not have the overwelm me.

I would feel great if some people out there who understand these kind of feelings toward lust to post here to reashure me that I am not the only one who see's this.
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Old 12-12-2010, 12:42 AM
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I tend to think the fangirls are more lustful than the fanboys. I know that some Neytiri fans (I included) really love her, and I'm sure the same is true for some of the fangirls, they just tend to be more...raunchy. The Na'vi are an incredibly beautiful people physically, and I think it is perfectly fine to feel attraction to them because of that (anyone who would say that physical attraction plays no part in love is kidding themselves), but it is their emotional and spiritual qualities that really make them attractive. With that said I hardly call it lust. It becomes lust when one allows physical beauty to be the sole reason of attraction.

Another thing I wonder is if saying things about the mating scene is just possibly a way to break tension? A lot of us would probably give anything to be able to make tsaheylu, especially with someone like Neytiri (or reverse for the fangirls), and I know that not being able to make tsaheylu was a reason for PAD with a lot of people. Maybe trying to take the seriousness and passion out of the scene is a way for people to deal with their emotions?
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Old 12-12-2010, 02:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rainbowhawk1993 View Post
I've seen alot of meida expressing lustful feelings, and I just look at most at it as destroying the meaning of bueaty and love.

I know that for a fact that alot of people here just adore Neytiri and occasonaly give a one line and one of these:

But some of these coments bother me sometimes because they go alittle too far in the nessisary Inuendo. One example was when I wrote about the extended mating scene when I saw the SE, some people were writing about if Jake was having dirty thoughts before the connetion. I disturbed me because it just spoils the feeling of deep emotion and love.

When I was drawing my first Fan art of the Na'vi women with the blue flute, she was nude. But I didn't have the feeling of overwhelming lust when I was looking creating her. I was creating her because I was compeled by physical bueaty like when Jack drew Rose in Titanic. Don't get me wrong, I do have occasional feelings of lust but I'm working hard to not have the overwelm me.

I would feel great if some people out there who understand these kind of feelings toward lust to post here to reashure me that I am not the only one who see's this.
I know exactly what you mean. I almost want to say it's hurtful to hear those kinds of things.
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Old 12-12-2010, 02:56 AM
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I tend to agree with this. I love Neytiri and don't like seeing porn of her... it feels like a violation to me.
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Old 12-12-2010, 04:01 AM
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There is only a difference if you want there to be. A component of love IS physical and too many people seem (or try) to forget that... I really don't mind the more 'fangirl-style' depictions and comments , because, the truth is, I love Neytiri is more ways, including emotionally and physically. Is any one better than the other? Of course not. They are equally valid and BOTH are an important part of most people's love for Neytiri/Jake.

As for tsaheylu, Tsyal Makto has an interesting point... I would give so much to be able to experience it, and yes, the thought makes me very sad and lonely , but I've never 'taken the seriousness out', intentionally or otherwise and I can't see anyone else that I would consider as having done that.
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Old 12-12-2010, 04:25 AM
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There isn't, actually, anything WRONG with lust, you know. It's perfectly natural. And frankly the Na'vi are at a disadvantage with all of Cameron's "yeah, Neytiri had to have tits" statements.

That said, I don't find them at all "hot". Pretty to look at, yes, but they wear their nudity like I would my clothes. They are perfectly capable of being sexual beings (and this includes Neytiri), but just because I acknowledge this (and will probably end up writing it, whenever I get around to writing Jake/Neytiri), doesn't mean I feel any attraction TO them.

And, erm, I don't see why lust has to ruin love? It's another component of love, even as it can stand by itself, as well. Trouble is, we're still trying to kick the "sex = dirty" attitude we've been stuck with for well over a hundred years. Sex is bad, sex is dirty, sex ruins the purity of romantic love, etc. Which is frankly a load of bull, it's just society and culture and historical values we as a society don't really know how to shake off yet.

I'm not sure if I should be insulted by those comments re: fangirls or not.
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Old 12-12-2010, 04:48 AM
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Don't get me wrong. I both lust after and love Neytiri... but somehow I don't like seeing porn of her (unless it's very tasteful). Anything more than that feels like a violation of her by the artist.
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Old 12-12-2010, 04:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ISV Venture Star View Post
Don't get me wrong. I both lust after and love Neytiri... but somehow I don't like seeing porn of her (unless it's tasteful).
Seeing or reading, and how do you define "tasteful"?
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Old 12-12-2010, 04:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Ashen Key View Post
Seeing or reading, and how do you define "tasteful"?
I don't read fanfiction, generally speaking. Which is kind of rude of me, as I've just started writing it.

I've seen porn of Neytiri but I only saved some of the least explicit and most canonical drawings. I don't want to look at AMP suit Quaritch working her over with a dildo.
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Old 12-12-2010, 04:58 AM
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Well, I find the Na'vi extremely attractive, they are perfect in every way and their features are so desirable...
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Originally Posted by Ashen Key View Post
And, erm, I don't see why lust has to ruin love? It's another component of love, even as it can stand by itself, as well. Trouble is, we're still trying to kick the "sex = dirty" attitude we've been stuck with for well over a hundred years. Sex is bad, sex is dirty, sex ruins the purity of romantic love, etc. Which is frankly a load of bull, it's just society and culture and historical values we as a society don't really know how to shake off yet.
Now here, I agree - people are too inhibited. However, there is still no reason that someone can't be sexually and emotionally attracted to someone.
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Old 12-12-2010, 04:58 AM
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Originally Posted by ISV Venture Star View Post
I don't read fanfiction, generally speaking. Which is kind of rude of me, as I've just started writing it.
I generally find it doesn't hurt! The more you read, the better writer one tends to be, after all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ISV Venture Star View Post
I've seen porn of Neytiri but I only saved some of the least explicit and most canonical drawings. I don't want to look at AMP suit Quaritch working her over with a dildo.
Being in-character is as important for sex as anything else, and that just strikes me as being so OOC on BOTH their parts it's not funny. IC is good.

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Originally Posted by Human No More View Post
Well, I find the Na'vi extremely attractive, they are perfect in every way and their features are so desirable...
*grins* I don't. When I'm attracted to women, I tend to prefer them with far more curves. Give me Trudy any day over Neytiri, as it were. Which doesn't mean there is anything wrong with YOU finding them attractive, not all. Just, I wouldn't call them 'perfect'.

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Originally Posted by Human No More View Post
Now here, I agree - people are too inhibited. However, there is still no reason that someone can't be sexually and emotionally attracted to someone.
Exactly. If I gave the impression I think you can't combine sexual and emotional attraction, my bad, I did not mean that at all.
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Old 12-12-2010, 05:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Ashen Key View Post
When I'm attracted to women, I tend to prefer them with far more curves. Give me Trudy any day over Neytiri, as it were. Which doesn't mean there is anything wrong with YOU finding them attractive, not all. Just, I wouldn't call them 'perfect'.
Reminds me of this quote from Jordu Schell:

Quote:
What about the sex appeal aspect of it? Was the sexiness something James Cameron emphasized with you?

Well, he wanted them to be very beautiful. And I do believe that, at some point, he said something to the effect of...the audience has to want to **** her. I mean, Jim is very plain in his language.

So, I went, "All right?" So I made something that, I don't know if I really particularly wanted to **** it, but it was certainly a beautiful alien. He definitely, he wanted it — because he really prefers women that are kind of athletic, and buff and stuff like that, so I, you know, designed something with big hands and feet, a big presence that felt really big and strong.

So it was designed for his personal preferences in terms of sexiness?

It certainly wasn't mine. I mean, I would have sculpted, I don't know, Gretchen Mol or something. But I sculpted this big, tall, buff, kind of tough-looking, kick-ass woman.

Last edited by ISV Venture Star; 12-12-2010 at 05:17 AM.
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Old 12-12-2010, 05:20 AM
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Originally Posted by ISV Venture Star View Post
Reminds me of this quote from Jordu Schell:
That IS an interesting quote. I still find the Na'vi to be slim, though. Athletic, yes, but lean and long and flat-stomach and slim and rather adolescent in a lot of ways. Which. I don't find attractive. *shrugs*
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Old 12-12-2010, 05:25 AM
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Neytiri is lithe and athletic and graceful and nubile and pert... what's not to love?

I also think that Jake (especially towards the end of the film) has pretty much the ideal male form, the shape I would like to have myself.
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Old 12-12-2010, 05:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Ashen Key View Post
*grins* I don't. When I'm attracted to women, I tend to prefer them with far more curves. Give me Trudy any day over Neytiri, as it were. Which doesn't mean there is anything wrong with YOU finding them attractive, not all. Just, I wouldn't call them 'perfect'.
I prefer the Na'vi - everything about them is more to my tastes from their body shape (and height ) to their skin colour and those beautiful eyes... Humans just can't compare.

Quote:
Exactly. If I gave the impression I think you can't combine sexual and emotional attraction, my bad, I did not mean that at all.
Good to know.


And about rule 34, yes, I've seen it, and yes, some of it is very bad, but then there are some far more tasteful, almost beautiful pieces that in my opinion really show the passion that they have, which you can not deny exists

Quote:
Originally Posted by AC130StandingBy View Post
^This. Amen tsmukan.

I deeply resent the fact that so many people view her as a sex object. She's a full package; I care about her character just as much, if not more than her body.
I care about both, but I see no sense in ignoring one in favour of the other, in either way. She is FAR more attractive than any human, and the Na'vi in general are simply beautiful.
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