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Old 02-01-2011, 05:44 AM
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Default Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment

The link between Mind and Social / Environmental-Issues.

The fast-paced, consumerist lifestyle of Industrial Society is causing exponential rise in psychological problems besides destroying the environment. All issues are interlinked. Our Minds cannot be peaceful when attention-spans are down to nanoseconds, microseconds and milliseconds. Our Minds cannot be peaceful if we destroy Nature.

The first rule of sustainability is - destroy less.

The fewer things we make the more sustainable we are.

A society that destroys ecosystems for "consumer goods" in addition to food, clothing and shelter is the least sustainable - and will exist for the shortest duration.

Industrial society has destroyed necessary things [animals, trees, air, water and land] for making unnecessary things [consumer goods].

In "Industrial Society" work turns into overwork, unnecessary work, destructive work.


"Growth Rate" - "Economy Rate" - "GDP"
These are figures of "Ecocide".
These are figures of "crimes against Nature".
These are figures of "destruction of Ecosystems".
These are figures of "Insanity, Abnormality and Criminality".

Infinite growth and development on a small planet that is just 40,000 km in circumference? - Industrial Society is insane.



To read the complete article please follow any of these links :

EnviroLink Forum • View topic - Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment
PowerSwitch :: View topic - Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment
ILovePhilosophy.com • Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment


sushil_yadav
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Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment
  #2  
Old 02-01-2011, 06:08 AM
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Cross posting and using your own opinions as evidence...

In which you suggested an experiment...

Then tell us what would be the results...

Without preforming it.


...

I can't debate this. I can BS through an argument with it, but I can't debate it.



((I think you're telling us we have to become stupid in order to survive. ))

...
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Old 02-01-2011, 06:55 AM
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.......

The experiments I have proposed are primarily meant for those people who understand only the language of science. We don't need experiments to understand that our present lifestyle is destroying our Minds and Environment - the evidence is everywhere - left, right and center. The craze and fetish for science and scientific proof has mainly existed for the last 50 - 100 years. People have lived on this planet for thousands of years without needing scientific proof to understand something. It is Science and Technology that created the consumerist Industrial Society which has led to the destruction of Mind and Nature/ Environment. Who needs more science or more scientific proof. Science is not the solution - Science is the problem.

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Old 02-01-2011, 07:41 AM
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Science, by itself, is neither the solution nor the problem. The way science is currently looked at and used, however - there's the real problem.
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Old 02-01-2011, 08:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eltu View Post
Science, by itself, is neither the solution nor the problem. The way science is currently looked at and used, however - there's the real problem.
This. I agree with this statement. It is the way we use science and technology that causes many of the problems.

sushil_yadav, in this day and age, you better substantiate your claims with evidence. You can claim to be a philosopher, but your statements don't mean squat if they are simply wishful thoughts. Those are called opinions, not facts.
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Old 02-01-2011, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sushil_yadav View Post
.......

The experiments I have proposed are primarily meant for those people who understand only the language of science. We don't need experiments to understand that our present lifestyle is destroying our Minds and Environment - the evidence is everywhere - left, right and center. The craze and fetish for science and scientific proof has mainly existed for the last 50 - 100 years. People have lived on this planet for thousands of years without needing scientific proof to understand something. It is Science and Technology that created the consumerist Industrial Society which has led to the destruction of Mind and Nature/ Environment. Who needs more science or more scientific proof. Science is not the solution - Science is the problem.

sushil_yadav

No, we've tried to "explain things" using reason and logic as long as we've been able to think. Look around, the world looks flat, so, they thought the world was flat. That's science, not very good science, but science nonetheless. Rain, they thought there were floodgates in the sky, it made sense, and they had no evidence to support any other theory, more science. We invented the wheel, bows and arrows, shelters, food storage...

Our minds are the only reason we've survived and prospered. Only reason, without that, we'd be dead.
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Old 02-02-2011, 03:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isard View Post
Our minds are the only reason we've survived and prospered. Only reason, without that, we'd be dead.
The two things that have destroyed Environment are - Overpopulation and Overconsumerism.

Science, Technology and Industrialization are responsible for both these problems. World population was less than 1 billion in the year 1800. Nature had its way of controlling population through disease and death caused by bacteria and virus. When man made medicines/ antibiotics he created disaster - population increased very rapidly. In the absence of "Industrial Agriculture" the feeding capacity of soil would have kept population under control. If Industrial Revolution had not happened, environmental destruction due to production of consumer goods would not exist. In the absence of Science, Technology and "Industrial Revolution" we would not be facing the two problems that have caused destruction of ecosystems - overpopulation and overconsumerism.

If "Industrial Revolution" had not happened what would be the scenario today?

The feeding capacity of soil would have kept population under control.

Diseases caused by virus and bacteria would have kept population under control.

Maybe I would'nt be existing today - and billions of others may not have existed - but millions/ billions of humans would exist [just like they existed before Industrialization]

Most ecosystems would be hundreds of times/ thousands of times in better shape than today.

Millions of other species that have been decimated by Industrial Society would be existing in very healthy numbers - their population levels thousands of times greater than what they are now.

Providing food, clothing, shelter and healthcare is good. But did "Industrial Society" stop at that?

Do we have an Industrial Society that only provides food, clothing, shelter and healthcare to people?

No - the jokers tried to sell hundreds of consumer goods to all citizens of Industrial Society. They tried to make all people consumerists.

Industrial Society started destroying ecosystems for "consumer goods" in addition to destroying them for food, clothing and shelter.

You cannot do this on a small planet that is just 40,000 km in circumference. If you live this way you end up destroying all ecosystems - you end up decimating all other species - you end up destroying animals, trees, air, water and land - the very things that created and sustained all life on earth.


Over-exploitation of ecosystems became possible only due to modern technology/ machines.

In the absence of modern technology/ machines it would be impossible for man to destroy all ecosystems.

If modern technology/ machines had not come into existence man would
have probably destroyed some ecosystems on land [forests] - and that
too at a much slower rate than that of the present Industrial Society.

It would have been impossible for man to destroy ecosystems in the sea/ oceans.

It would have been impossible for man to carry out largescale mining
activity and destroy ecosystems on the surface and deep inside the
earth.

It would have been impossible for man to poison the earth with thousands of toxic chemicals.

It would have been impossible for man to generate billions of tonnes of
solid, liquid and gaseous waste that has poisoned the air, water and
land - the entire planet.

It would have been impossible for man to generate billions of tonnes of
metal waste, plastic waste, eWaste, nuclear waste...... that has
poisoned the entire planet.

The Machine has killed all ecosystems.

It is impossible to save the remaining ecosystems as long as the machine exists.

The Machine will devour everything that remains on earth.

Machine is the killer.



sushil_yadav

Last edited by sushil_yadav; 02-02-2011 at 03:04 AM.
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Old 02-02-2011, 03:13 AM
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And this is why we build machines to expand beyond our little planet.

We're innovative, expansive, and above all, dedicated. There is no way to contain or curb us.
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Old 02-02-2011, 03:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sushil_yadav View Post
The two things that have destroyed Environment are - Overpopulation and Overconsumerism.
Well, considering you live in India
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Old 02-05-2011, 06:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isard View Post
And this is why we build machines to expand beyond our little planet.

We're innovative, expansive, and above all, dedicated. There is no way to contain or curb us.
Moving to another planet would probably rank as the most impossible of all impossible things.

One space shuttle exploded during take off - another exploded on the return journey.

So far man has not been able to go beyond the moon. There is no other life sustaining ecosystem/ planet within the solar system. Outside the solar system planets and galaxies are millions of light years away - billions of light years away.


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  #11  
Old 02-05-2011, 07:22 AM
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Originally Posted by sushil_yadav View Post
Moving to another planet would probably rank as the most impossible of all impossible things.

One space shuttle exploded during take off - another exploded on the return journey.

So far man has not been able to go beyond the moon. There is no other life sustaining ecosystem/ planet within the solar system. Outside the solar system planets and galaxies are millions of light years away - billions of light years away.


sushil_yadav


And the hundreds that worked fine in between?


I'm sure people have been crushed by trees in the past, outlaw foliage?
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Old 02-05-2011, 01:28 PM
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......

And how far did the hundreds that worked fine go?


This planet was home to millions of species - man has decimated all other species.

After destroying millions of highly-developed species on earth Man is today searching for a few molecules of life in outer-space.

If a few microbes, a few molecules of methane / water are found on Mars - it becomes the newspaper headline.

They call it progress.

Life on earth is sustained by animals, trees, air, water and fertile soil. It is height of insanity to first destroy all these things on earth and then make plans to move to another planet.

The sane option is - don't destroy life sustaining things on earth.


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Last edited by sushil_yadav; 02-05-2011 at 01:45 PM.
  #13  
Old 02-05-2011, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sushil_yadav View Post
Moving to another planet would probably rank as the most impossible of all impossible things.

One space shuttle exploded during take off - another exploded on the return journey.
Due to defective design, yes. Statistically, the STS was safer than Apollo, and re-entry and low orbit are far, far, far more dangerous then flight in space, because space is empty. No atmosphere, no heating from re-entry, and no debris. The only risk is radiation, which the Earth's magnetic field shields people on it from, but that is still capable of being mitigated without significant problems.

Quote:
So far man has not been able to go beyond the moon. There is no other life sustaining ecosystem/ planet within the solar system. Outside the solar system planets and galaxies are millions of light years away - billions of light years away.
There is no need to go to another galaxy... there are planets in the habitable zone tens to hundreds of light years away - theoretically reachable with a generational ship or cryo, and while direct FTL travel is impossible based on current understanding of physics, nothing rules out other methods that produce an overall FTL speed but without moving faster than light in local space.
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Old 02-21-2012, 01:06 PM
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Default Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment

Food, Clothing & Shelter......these are the maximum number of things this planet can provide to humans....... Industrial consumer goods must be eliminated immediately.

Industrial Society is doing research on sustainability after destroying 75 - 90% of Biodiversity and Ecosystems. Nature has already done millions of years of research on sustainability.......Nature has already given us millions of years of proof of sustainability. Animals did not destroy Environment for millions of years because their activity was limited to searching for food. Hunter Gatherer Society did not destroy Environment for a million years because their activity was limited to searching for food. Agrarian Society caused very limited destruction of environment over 10,000 years [compared to Industrial Society]because their activity was limited to food, clothing and shelter.



For the last 50 years Intellectuals have been debating what is good for Environment......Capitalist Industrial Society, Communist Industrial Society or Socialist Industrial Society?

This is like debating what is good for people.....Capitalist Poison, Communist Poison or Socialist Poison.

Poison kills people.....it does'nt matter who made it ......Capitalism, Communism or Socialism.

Industrial Activity kills ecosystems.....It does'nt matter which system runs it.....Capitalism, Communism or Socialism.

All Industrial Activity destroys environment......Mining Industry, Logging Industry, Energy Generation Industry, Manufacturing Industry, Transportation Industry, Construction Industry, Recycling Industry, Oil Drilling, Oil Refining, Millions of kilometers of Rail & Road network and Shipping Lanes…..they all destroy environment….. It does'nt matter which system runs it.....Capitalism, Communism or Socialism.

American Industrial Activity has destroyed ecosystems…..Russian Industrial Activity has destroyed ecosystems……Chinese Industrial Activity has destroyed ecosystems…….Indian Industrial Activity has destroyed ecosystems……Every Industrial Society destroys ecosystems…… It does'nt matter which system runs it.....Capitalism, Communism or Socialism.

In just 250 years Industrial Society has destroyed 75 - 90% of Forests, Wild Animals and Fish Population......Population of Lions, Tigers and Elephants is down to 2 - 5% of what it was 100 years ago......Population of Large Fish in Oceans is down to 10% of what it was 100 years ago.....Industrial Society has poisoned the entire planet with Trillions of Tonnes of Metal Waste, Plastic Waste, Chemical Waste, Gaseous Waste, eWaste, Nuclear Waste.....It has killed Trillions of Animals in Industrial Slaughter Houses and billions of acres of Fertile Soil with Cement And Concrete.

Animals did not destroy Environment for millions of years.......because their activity was limited to searching for food.

Hunter Gatherer Society did not destroy Environment for a million years.......because their activity was limited to searching for food.

Agrarian Society caused very limited destruction of environment over 10,000 years[compared to Industrial Society].......because their activity was limited to food, clothing and shelter.

Industrial Society has destroyed almost all Ecosystems in just 250 years......because it is destroying environment for thousands of consumer goods and services in addition to food, clothing and shelter.

Industrial Activity for production of Consumer Goods must stop immediately.......Human work must be limited to Food, Clothing and Shelter......And even in these three fields production and consumption must be kept to the minimum.



There is only one cause of environmental destruction......Industrialization.

Overpopulation and Overconsumerism are only consequences/ by-products of Industrialization.

Overconsumerism is quite obviously a consequence of Industrialization..... Industrial consumer goods and services would not exist without Industrial Activity.

Overpopulation is also a by-product of Industrialization. The entire world was overbreeding until the middle years of 20th century.....even Western Countries had 5 - 12 children per family[and even more].....and yet population of the world remained low before industrialization because of high death rate, lower life span and shortage of food and water. It was only 1 billion in 1800 AD. India and China have large populations today because they started with larger populations thousands of years ago, since ancient civilizations thrived in these regions. What was the population of Europe/ America/ West 2000 years ago????......Was it comparable to eastern population of India and China????

Industrialization is the cause of overpopulation and overconsumerism.

Moreover, Environment has been destroyed by Industrialization/ Consumerism…….Not by Population/ Overpopulation.

Total World Population has not increased ……It has decreased……In fact total world population has been decimated.

When we talk of population we should take into account population of all animal species, not just human population.

Industrial Society has decimated millions of Animal Species……Increase in human population has coincided with decrease/ decimation of millions of animal species. The total burden of population on this planet has not increased…..It has decreased.

Industrial Society has decimated millions of other species.....but there was a time when the combined population of other animal species was much greater than present human population.....and we don't even need to include smaller animals in this count.....the combined population of big animals alone whose size and weight was equivalent to or greater than man was much greater than current human population of 7 billion.

The amount of food this animal population was eating was much greater than the food consumed by humans today.......Yet millions of animal species did not destroy environment and lived sustainably on earth for millions of years......because they destroyed environment only for food and not for thousands of consumer goods and services.

If animals had started a consumerist "Industrial Society" millions of years ago they would have destroyed all ecosystems millions of years ago.

The entire world has been trying to control human population for 50 years and these efforts should / will continue in future.....so where is the problem with population?????

What is the cause of human overpopulation??????......It is Industrialization......World population increased from 1 billion in 1800 to 7 billion today ........In the absence of Industrialization world population would only be a small fraction of 7 billion today.

It is not population that destroys environment......It is lifestyle.......The combined population of millions of animal species was much greater than present human population.......and yet they did not destroy environment for millions of years because they destroyed environment only for Food.......not for Thousands of Consumer Goods.

The cause of Environmental Destruction is Industrialization / Consumerism.........Not population / overpopulation.

A Hunter_Gatherer Society of 7 billion would not destroy environment [And a Hunter_Gatherer Society would never reach a population of 7 billion]

An Agrarian Society of 7 billion would cause much lesser environmental destruction than an Industrial Society of 7 billion [And an Agrarian Society would never reach a population of 7 billion]

Industrialization is the cause of Human Overpopulation and Overconsumerism

It is so ridiculous of Industrial Society to complain about overpopulation when it itself is the cause of overpopulation......It is so ridiculous of Industrial Society to make attempts to control population while promoting Consumerism, Growth Rate, Economy Rate and GDP exponentially.

Height of Insanity!

Industrial Activity for production of Consumer Goods must stop immediately.......Human work must be limited to Food, Clothing and Shelter.


sushil_yadav
Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment
  #15  
Old 02-21-2012, 09:13 PM
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This planet could easily hold 20 billion people with certain technology and circumstances. We can gain energy from far better, cleaner sources, but we don't. We don't need many of these products made, but they're made and sold anyway.

Not to be all activist, but I think we need better, smarter leaders in charge of our species. To moderate all this.
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