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  #46  
Old 04-29-2010, 04:13 PM
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I don't know what to believe in and that doesn't annoy me. I'm happy with my life as it is.
  #47  
Old 04-29-2010, 08:57 PM
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I always tell this one little piece myself...


"Beliefs are only toys that you play around with until you experience them.
You juggle it around and around until you experience All That Is."


How you interpret this is up to you.
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Last edited by Txantsulsam Fyawintxu; 04-29-2010 at 09:01 PM.
  #48  
Old 04-29-2010, 11:13 PM
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What I cannot unerstand is why people belive in god just for an answers. Just because people cant understand or figure something out they go to religion, which really gives no answers. They basicly say that a god created everything and yadah yadah yadah. I gives no proof for this and really only makes you ask more questions. They tell you god created everything thing and just because you cant understand everything you believe them. Science cant explain everything we cant know everything but thats no reason to believe in a god. How did god get here? what was here before him? so many unanswered questions YET NOBODY QUESTIONS ANYTHING. Athiests are the ones who dare to question these things. What Im trying to say is that just because we dont understand everything now is no reason to tak the easy way out and believe in god.
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  #49  
Old 04-29-2010, 11:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Harvester of Sorrow View Post
What I cannot unerstand is why people belive in god just for an answers. Just because people cant understand or figure something out they go to religion, which really gives no answers. They basicly say that a god created everything and yadah yadah yadah.
All of the above is completely untrue.
  #50  
Old 04-29-2010, 11:31 PM
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You think it to be untrue but its not, you may think that you belive for a different reason but you dont. People believe in god for the answer to why we are here. Whether you like it or not thats that.
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Old 04-30-2010, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Harvester of Sorrow View Post
You think it to be untrue but its not, you may think that you belive for a different reason but you dont. People believe in god for the answer to why we are here. Whether you like it or not thats that.
That's not my reason. I believe in God (particularly the Christian one) primarily because the evidence surrounding Christianity is so apparent. I believe because of evidence, plain and simple. And if you think everyone who believes in a god believes just because they "don't understand" certain aspects of the universe or science, and would rather replace such with a deity that solves the unknown simply by existing, you're mistaken.

...At least, with me you are. With some others... let's just call 'em "Ameners". Those are the types of theists I don't particularly respect. And I'm sure that's who you mean to refer to.

Last edited by Woodsprite; 04-30-2010 at 12:19 AM.
  #52  
Old 04-30-2010, 01:17 AM
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This is the second time you have mentioned evidence, what evidence?
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  #53  
Old 04-30-2010, 01:25 AM
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people believe in gods to give them peace of mind about what happens after you die.

i, personally, believe in Eywa.
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  #54  
Old 04-30-2010, 03:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Harvester of Sorrow View Post
This is the second time you have mentioned evidence, what evidence?
Historical, archeological, cosmological, biological, prophetic...

I can't start in any particular area without it being regulated by someone point-by-point. Even the History Channel recognizes the historical (and some of the scientific) value of the Bible, not that I necessarily agree with everything they put out on their network. But to me, it's a bit laughable to not recognize all the data pieces in favor of an existing god (though not proof, but still evidence), and I feel a bit sorry for those who haven't read into everything regarding it.

Not that I'm referring to you, just that some believe that God as represented in any religion (particularly Christianity) is purely based in faith and faith alone, with absolutely nothing else to support such an entity. This is a false assumption.
  #55  
Old 04-30-2010, 03:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodsprite View Post
Not that I'm referring to you, just that some believe that God as represented in any religion (particularly Christianity) is purely based in faith and faith alone, with absolutely nothing else to support such an entity. This is a false assumption.
Only if you believe in the infallibility of an ancient book with uncertain origins which has been rewritten, translated, retranslated, edited and censored as long as it has existed...
The only claims of is accuracy are based on it itself... The Circular Reasoning of Christian Apologetics
A simplified explanation of the same logic:

No proof there.
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  #56  
Old 04-30-2010, 04:28 PM
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Every time I ask myself about the Universe, I think: "Who the hell would have put the Big Bang?". As I try to avoid as many times as possible the answer "God did", one of my answers might be "Maybe because the matter of a previous Universe collapsed, perhaps concentrated by the effect of the black holes (and incredible amount of mass reduced to a tiny tiny space, that has to go somewhere; I say their nucleus attract themselves in the deformed space so when they find themselves by gravity force, or there is a Big Bang, or it keeps swallowing matter until it explodes because of the excess of energy)"

Now, after the long answer, I ask "And where did that previous Universe come from?" I say "Well, perhaps matter existed forever?"

There is a point in which you have to concede there has been a something that created everything from the nothing (pictured as a Creator) or that everything existed forever (basing yourself in the conservation of mass).

Just saying. I don't know what to choose, I've got no proof of both of them and can only speculate about it. Same for the Big Bang or God: they are both theories based in different facts (Doppler effect and Bible, respectively).

Ah, agnosticism... I love it.
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  #57  
Old 04-30-2010, 04:48 PM
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Exactly Zenit. There comes a point where you must ask, how did this all come about. It actually takes more faith to say that this is all by accident, that the big bang was just accidental, etc than to say that someone outside of time and space started it (ie. God). To me, its easier to believe that than to think that everything is random.

As for as Harvester of Sorrow, I don't believe in God because science can't explain everything. That is not my reasons for believing in God. There are mysteries in this world that science will never be able to contemplate. I chose the humble path by acknowledging that I don't know everything and trust that God does. It takes faith and reason. I understand that you don't believe that and I know there is nothing that I can say that will make you understand. We see the world through many different eyes.

Human no More: this is the reason why I don't normally use the Bible in discussions such as these. There is always the danger of circular reasoning and when a discussion/debate devolves into that it usually gets nowhere.
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  #58  
Old 04-30-2010, 05:49 PM
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EDITED: I've placed my reply in the new thread on evolution: Evolution Theory - Creationism
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Last edited by Sonoran Na'vi; 04-30-2010 at 07:07 PM. Reason: Moved post to new thread
  #59  
Old 04-30-2010, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Human No More View Post
Only if you believe in the infallibility of an ancient book with uncertain origins which has been rewritten, translated, retranslated, edited and censored as long as it has existed...
Obviously you've read neither into the Dead Sea scrolls, nor any other extra-Biblical recent findings...

And obviously, we cannot trust such works as Plato, Aristotle, or Homer since they've all been rewritten, translated, retranslated, edited, and sometimes censored as long as they've existed... You take that logic far enough and we can talk about the writings of George Washington, or King George I. Rewriting has absolutely nothing to do with accuracy; you don't understand the incredibly strict scribe rules the Hebrews followed, not to mention those who wrote the New Testament. I could go on for pages with this...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Human No More View Post
The only claims of is accuracy are based on it itself... The Circular Reasoning of Christian Apologetics
A simplified explanation of the same logic:

No proof there.
Nice chart, bad reasoning. A more accurate interpretation (take it from the real thing):

The Bible is the Word of God.
--But how can you be sure it's the word of god?
Because the Bible tells us so.
--But why believe the Bible?
Because of the countless archeological, historical, prophetic, and physical evidence it's supported by through Biblical and extra-Biblical sources that have stood the test of time.

There is no circle because the reasoning stops there. Whether or not the Bible is infallible is your choice to believe (though I believe it is, that's my belief, and I can support it thoroughly). If you're willing to look (or ask) for it, you won't get very far before discovering why so many believe it to be true. That is, if you aren't a thief who can't find a policeman.


@Sonoran Na'vi: Ah... I wish you hadn't included creation in the title. That means more posts for me to make that no one's willing to read! But I will be responding.

Last edited by Woodsprite; 05-01-2010 at 04:30 PM. Reason: Edited out one of the "@" replies; no longer needed.
  #60  
Old 04-30-2010, 07:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodsprite View Post
@Sonoran Na'vi: Ah... I wish you hadn't included creation in the title. That means more posts for me to make that no one's willing to read! But I will be responding.

Haha, I didn't create the title of the thread (I give Zenit the full credit for that)...

Anyway, I look forward to your response...
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