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Old 04-25-2010, 07:03 AM
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Default Did humans use to care more?

Rewatching avatar again, made me realise, at some point in our early existence we must have been similar to them in some respects. Prehaps we were more inclinded to a spiritual being, and if you believe such things times were better because god could connect with us, as he stuggles to with us now. I dont know the details, but it sounds like at some point we were much more appreciative and connected with our surroundings.

Last edited by Cyan; 04-25-2010 at 07:06 AM.
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Old 04-25-2010, 07:17 AM
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Well yes and no..I mean from the moment we could build, we built walls which not only protected us from predators but kept out nature..Civilisations, well most of them have done this ever since such as the Greek and Roman Empires.
However, local tribes, hermits and shamans all live in nature for as long as we have existed so there is hope for us.
We just need to tune in to our surroundings, maybe spend a little while away from human civilisation. Even going to a beach or camping could help
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Old 04-25-2010, 07:39 AM
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Yes, then civilization arose and greed overtook humanity.
life became about aquiring material possessions and power.

and that has become popular.
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Old 04-25-2010, 08:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Txum_kali'weya View Post
Yes, then civilization arose and greed overtook humanity.
life became about aquiring material possessions and power.
I might be inclined to blame the rise of agriculture for that. Such practices allowed more production from a smaller number of people. Other people could then focus on different tasks outside of hunter/gatherer activities while food was produced through agricultural practices. The fact that people were able to produce a larger variety of goods increased the act of trading. What this also did was allow groups and individuals the greater ability to accumulate wealth, leading to a greater stratification of society.
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Old 04-25-2010, 08:50 AM
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Here's a great quote from the movie about man's greed from the film Apocalypto that moved me:

And a Man sat alone, drenched deep in sadness. And all the animals drew near to him and said, "We do not like to see you so sad. Ask us for whatever you wish and you shall have it." The Man said, "I want to have good sight." The vulture replied, "You shall have mine." The Man said, "I want to be strong." The jaguar said, "You shall be strong like me." Then the Man said, "I long to know the secrets of the earth." The serpent replied, "I will show them to you." And so it went with all the animals. And when the Man had all the gifts that they could give, he left. Then the owl said to the other animals, "Now the Man knows much, he'll be able to do many things. Suddenly I am afraid." The deer said, "The Man has all that he needs. Now his sadness will stop." But the owl replied, "No. I saw a hole in the Man, deep like a hunger he will never fill. It is what makes him sad and what makes him want. He will go on taking and taking, until one day the World will say, 'I am no more and I have nothing left to give.'"
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"The man who learns only what others know is as ignorant as if he learns nothing.
The treasures of knowledge are the most rare, and guarded most harshly."
-Chronicle of the First Age


"Try to see the forest through her eyes."

Réalisant mon espoir, Je me lance vers la gloire. Je ne regrette rien. (Making my hope come true, I hurl myself toward glory. I regret nothing.)

Last edited by Pa'li Makto; 04-26-2010 at 02:31 AM.
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  #6  
Old 04-25-2010, 11:11 PM
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What movie is that from?

I think I have to agree on the agriculture thing.
I think what happened was, that early hunter gatherers did not feel the need to take more than they need. What for anyways. But in some places of the world, life was harsh and people had to face long winters which required stockpiling (meaning taking more than you need in summer so you have enough in winter). In other areas, growing food and domesticating animals seemed like a good solution to elude the search for scarce food sources in the desert regions. Now the first (the winter stockpiling) I think was not so much of a problem, but to growth of crops required land and the land ownership as well as ownership over domesticated animals came along. Now people owned land and animals and others could take it away or destroy it. Or drought could struck one field and not the neighbor's. So I think this is what brought many of the problems into the world, we see now. These people learned how to deal with such thinkgs and got very successful and radiated from their deserts all over the world. And what I think is, that this culture, that was born out of a need to fight a harsh environment, that required people to see the nature more as an enemy than a friend and that has radiated all over the globe strives to make the places they go "like home" in a way. It is Gaia Theory with a twist in that we humans determine our environment (even the hunters and gatherers did this in some ways) - but the dominant culture came from the desert and now turns this world into one.
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Old 04-25-2010, 11:30 PM
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the indians cared, then the white man came and made everything sh************t

Quote:
And a Man sat alone, drenched deep in sadness. And all the animals drew near to him and said, "We do not like to see you so sad. Ask us for whatever you wish and you shall have it." The Man said, "I want to have good sight." The vulture replied, "You shall have mine." The Man said, "I want to be strong." The jaguar said, "You shall be strong like me." Then the Man said, "I long to know the secrets of the earth." The serpent replied, "I will show them to you." And so it went with all the animals. And when the Man had all the gifts that they could give, he left. Then the owl said to the other animals, "Now the Man knows much, he'll be able to do many things. Suddenly I am afraid." The deer said, "The Man has all that he needs. Now his sadness will stop." But the owl replied, "No. I saw a hole in the Man, deep like a hunger he will never fill. It is what makes him sad and what makes him want. He will go on taking and taking, until one day the World will say, 'I am no more and I have nothing left to give.'"
shivers, just moved me...
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Old 04-26-2010, 02:32 AM
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Oh everyone that quote was from Apocalypto
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"The man who learns only what others know is as ignorant as if he learns nothing.
The treasures of knowledge are the most rare, and guarded most harshly."
-Chronicle of the First Age


"Try to see the forest through her eyes."

Réalisant mon espoir, Je me lance vers la gloire. Je ne regrette rien. (Making my hope come true, I hurl myself toward glory. I regret nothing.)
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Old 04-27-2010, 05:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyan View Post
Rewatching avatar again, made me realise, at some point in our early existence we must have been similar to them in some respects. Prehaps we were more inclinded to a spiritual being, and if you believe such things times were better because god could connect with us, as he stuggles to with us now. I dont know the details, but it sounds like at some point we were much more appreciative and connected with our surroundings.
That's no surprise because according to the bible we indeed were at point living in full harmony with the creator in a garden of unparalleled beauty and because of an act of disobedience humanity was cast out and has been struggling ever since.
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Old 04-27-2010, 05:14 AM
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Originally Posted by PunkMaister View Post
That's no surprise because according to the bible we indeed were at point living in full harmony with the creator in a garden of unparalleled beauty and because of an act of disobedience humanity was cast out and has been struggling ever since.
Eve was tempted, and then man fell into sin
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Old 04-27-2010, 05:22 AM
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Eve was tempted, and then man fell into sin
Yep, that pretty much sums it up, but God did promise that he would restore that which had been lost at some point too.
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Old 04-27-2010, 05:31 AM
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And when that might be is anyone's guess..
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My fanfic

"The man who learns only what others know is as ignorant as if he learns nothing.
The treasures of knowledge are the most rare, and guarded most harshly."
-Chronicle of the First Age


"Try to see the forest through her eyes."

Réalisant mon espoir, Je me lance vers la gloire. Je ne regrette rien. (Making my hope come true, I hurl myself toward glory. I regret nothing.)
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  #13  
Old 04-27-2010, 06:20 AM
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Originally Posted by PunkMaister View Post
Yep, that pretty much sums it up, but God did promise that he would restore that which had been lost at some point too.
True, it's all in His timing though
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Old 04-27-2010, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pa'li Makto View Post
Well yes and no..I mean from the moment we could build, we built walls which not only protected us from predators but kept out nature..Civilisations, well most of them have done this ever since such as the Greek and Roman Empires.
However, local tribes, hermits and shamans all live in nature for as long as we have existed so there is hope for us.
We just need to tune in to our surroundings, maybe spend a little while away from human civilisation. Even going to a beach or camping could help
Humans have been perverting natural things for some time. Unfortionately we need to protect ourselves from the many things that can harm us. In doing so we have constantly improved our dwellings and short cuts further advancing out of the natural world. Unlike our Na'vi friends, it seems hard to imagine humans not perverting our surroundings in some way. Sigh
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Old 04-27-2010, 08:17 AM
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I'm mr negative nancy tonight.
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