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  #16  
Old 08-23-2010, 12:53 AM
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If the roles were reversed, we'd all be dead
what?
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  #17  
Old 08-23-2010, 12:55 AM
Grif Grif is offline
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Honestly I feel that a strong female lead usually works better than a male one, provided she's not a sex object. I'm looking at you Angelina Jolie in Tomb Raider (although she was awesome in Salt).
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  #18  
Old 08-23-2010, 01:03 AM
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Originally Posted by rasomaso View Post
Anyway I think it would be kinda awkward, at least for me. Being a guy, I was really immersed into the movie "as Jake", I can't imagine Jake as the wise forest guy with amazing personality and Neytiri as a dumb grunt going someplace she's gonna regret... that's just... WRONG.
...I think I can. Just put Jake in the role with a more native accent, a different stance and walk, different diologue, and a different name; a Na'vi name. It would work just the same.

Now, take Zoe. A tough army gal who isn't the average girly girl, but still retains a lot of femininity. Her sister was a preppy girl; maybe had glasses and her hair done up. Zoe's was cut short; maybe chin-length. She comes in with just the same attitude as Jake did. Are you seeing it now? Just keep imagining. Grace meets her the same way she did with Jake... in fact, change Grace. Make Grace's character a man; different name. Make Norm a girl, only more of a bitchy-type intelligent girl who turns softer and softer toward Zoe's character (like Norm did with Jake).

Zoe's avatar has four fingers. Her hair is always unbraided. She knows physical combat, and she knows how to handle a weapon. Put her avatar in regular clothes. Have her talk with her normal accent, with a normal human-like stance and walk. Keep imagining it; don't think of the real movie, think of this. Have her almost killed by Jake instead, with the woodsprite landing on his arrow. Imagine his face; his way of speaking. Imagine his eyes, not looking around with a mystified expression all the time. He knows the ways. Imagine how he speaks Na'vi; it's his first language, not his second.

The viperwolves come after Zoe, and Jake saves her, but reprimands her. DON'T think of the real movie, keep imagining it the other way, as if this is Avatar. She's a teeny bit attracted to Jake. Imagine the scene, "You have a strong heart; no fear." Imagine Jake saying it; he's talking with a broken accent because he normally speaks Na'vi. His movement and delivery of the line is different; more masculine. "...But stupid! Ignorant like a child." Zoe's expression after this isn't like Jake's smirk, but rather a bit offended... yet inticed. She follows him...



Just imagine the movie was changed. The characters act differently, but are still the same. Zoe wouldn't act like Neytiri or think like her. But her personality would be just as brave, worthy, and likeable, I believe. Jake's character wouldn't be as cute if he were a regular from the Na'vi race, like he was when he was willing to learn, and found everything amazing since he witnessed it for the first time... but like Neytiri, his character would remain likeable, and we would root for him all the same.

Sure, the movie would be completely different, but it would still make a good film, I think.
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  #19  
Old 08-23-2010, 01:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by helicoradian View Post
what? :p
tl;dr
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  #20  
Old 08-23-2010, 01:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Woodsprite View Post
great post that took me on a trip
Wow woodsprite well done! I was enjoying it! Could you go through the whole movie??? kidding

But I actually want to do that, go through the movie as if Neytiri was Jake, with the roles reversed, although I can't see Grace or Norm switch to anything else

(loves these new Na'vi smilies )
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  #21  
Old 08-23-2010, 02:03 AM
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I'm starting to get a suspicious feeling that the sequel is going to be an alternate universe, exactly like this...
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  #22  
Old 08-23-2010, 03:21 AM
Grif Grif is offline
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I'm starting to get a suspicious feeling that the sequel is going to be an alternate universe, exactly like this...
I sort of doubt tha...
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  #23  
Old 08-23-2010, 05:44 AM
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But what would be the hook for a female avatar scientist? Jake's got an attitude because not only is he male, he's military and paralyzed
If Zoe's charcter was paralyzed also it's not as dramatic to have a female in the same situation. She'd be more like Trudy, so what's the catch? There has to be an emotional connection with the audience and the main character. Having Jake do the voice over, explaining his situation could be done with a female character but with our mindset that has been 'pre-programmed' by decades of story telling, the gender change would not have worked.
If you make the lead a female in Jake's place, then all the things that Neytiri did would have been done by a stereotypical male rescuing the helpless female. It would be more like Tarzan and Jane..an even more tired stereotype.
It wouldn't have worked. I'm looking at this from a story point of view, not the movie we know.
The story worked because of the characters in the position they were in.
Would Star Wars have worked as well if Leia had been in Luke's position? Nope.
It's a matter of story conventions and what we are familiar with in reading or watching a story unfold.
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  #24  
Old 08-23-2010, 06:05 AM
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so Zoe Saldana would be the Crippled X-Marine?.....
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  #25  
Old 08-23-2010, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodsprite View Post
...I think I can. Just put Jake in the role with a more native accent, a different stance and walk, different diologue, and a different name; a Na'vi name. It would work just the same.

Now, take Zoe. A tough army gal who isn't the average girly girl, but still retains a lot of femininity. Her sister was a preppy girl; maybe had glasses and her hair done up. Zoe's was cut short; maybe chin-length. She comes in with just the same attitude as Jake did. Are you seeing it now? Just keep imagining. Grace meets her the same way she did with Jake... in fact, change Grace. Make Grace's character a man; different name. Make Norm a girl, only more of a bitchy-type intelligent girl who turns softer and softer toward Zoe's character (like Norm did with Jake).

Zoe's avatar has four fingers. Her hair is always unbraided. She knows physical combat, and she knows how to handle a weapon. Put her avatar in regular clothes. Have her talk with her normal accent, with a normal human-like stance and walk. Keep imagining it; don't think of the real movie, think of this. Have her almost killed by Jake instead, with the woodsprite landing on his arrow. Imagine his face; his way of speaking. Imagine his eyes, not looking around with a mystified expression all the time. He knows the ways. Imagine how he speaks Na'vi; it's his first language, not his second.

The viperwolves come after Zoe, and Jake saves her, but reprimands her. DON'T think of the real movie, keep imagining it the other way, as if this is Avatar. She's a teeny bit attracted to Jake. Imagine the scene, "You have a strong heart; no fear." Imagine Jake saying it; he's talking with a broken accent because he normally speaks Na'vi. His movement and delivery of the line is different; more masculine. "...But stupid! Ignorant like a child." Zoe's expression after this isn't like Jake's smirk, but rather a bit offended... yet inticed. She follows him...



Just imagine the movie was changed. The characters act differently, but are still the same. Zoe wouldn't act like Neytiri or think like her. But her personality would be just as brave, worthy, and likeable, I believe. Jake's character wouldn't be as cute if he were a regular from the Na'vi race, like he was when he was willing to learn, and found everything amazing since he witnessed it for the first time... but like Neytiri, his character would remain likeable, and we would root for him all the same.

Sure, the movie would be completely different, but it would still make a good film, I think.
You see man, it doesn't work. How about the last scene with Jake holding Ney, the "I see you" scene? That would be so cheesy, at least a Capt. Picard's hand material.
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  #26  
Old 08-23-2010, 10:34 PM
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Yeah, I doubt that too

I don't see how it would make the scene at all cheesy or facepalm-worthy though... or do you really think there's such a difference in how characters should be played?
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  #27  
Old 08-23-2010, 10:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodsprite View Post
...I think I can. Just put Jake in the role with a more native accent, a different stance and walk, different diologue, and a different name; a Na'vi name. It would work just the same.

Now, take Zoe. A tough army gal who isn't the average girly girl, but still retains a lot of femininity. Her sister was a preppy girl; maybe had glasses and her hair done up. Zoe's was cut short; maybe chin-length. She comes in with just the same attitude as Jake did. Are you seeing it now? Just keep imagining. Grace meets her the same way she did with Jake... in fact, change Grace. Make Grace's character a man; different name. Make Norm a girl, only more of a bitchy-type intelligent girl who turns softer and softer toward Zoe's character (like Norm did with Jake).

Zoe's avatar has four fingers. Her hair is always unbraided. She knows physical combat, and she knows how to handle a weapon. Put her avatar in regular clothes. Have her talk with her normal accent, with a normal human-like stance and walk. Keep imagining it; don't think of the real movie, think of this. Have her almost killed by Jake instead, with the woodsprite landing on his arrow. Imagine his face; his way of speaking. Imagine his eyes, not looking around with a mystified expression all the time. He knows the ways. Imagine how he speaks Na'vi; it's his first language, not his second.

The viperwolves come after Zoe, and Jake saves her, but reprimands her. DON'T think of the real movie, keep imagining it the other way, as if this is Avatar. She's a teeny bit attracted to Jake. Imagine the scene, "You have a strong heart; no fear." Imagine Jake saying it; he's talking with a broken accent because he normally speaks Na'vi. His movement and delivery of the line is different; more masculine. "...But stupid! Ignorant like a child." Zoe's expression after this isn't like Jake's smirk, but rather a bit offended... yet inticed. She follows him...



Just imagine the movie was changed. The characters act differently, but are still the same. Zoe wouldn't act like Neytiri or think like her. But her personality would be just as brave, worthy, and likeable, I believe. Jake's character wouldn't be as cute if he were a regular from the Na'vi race, like he was when he was willing to learn, and found everything amazing since he witnessed it for the first time... but like Neytiri, his character would remain likeable, and we would root for him all the same.

Sure, the movie would be completely different, but it would still make a good film, I think.
James Cameron's script for Avatar 2.
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  #28  
Old 08-23-2010, 10:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Human No More View Post
I don't see how it would make the scene at all cheesy or facepalm-worthy though...
^this. It would be different, maybe in a bad way, but it would still be Avatar at the core.

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Originally Posted by Advent View Post
James Cameron's script for Avatar 2.
That's what I was thinking... would be quite a letdown though. Alternate timelines have been done and redone to death.
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  #29  
Old 08-24-2010, 03:05 AM
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I wish that Jake wasn't written as an American. Australian accent would have been cooler, plus the actor is from Australia I think.
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  #30  
Old 08-24-2010, 04:27 AM
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That's what I was thinking... would be quite a letdown though. Alternate timelines have been done and redone to death.
But I really seriously... 100% would doubt JC would do that. To James Cameron, we've only skimmed the surface of the water of his imagination of the Avatar world... the plans for the second movie will blow our minds! I just know it!
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