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  #1  
Old 04-06-2010, 03:13 AM
Sngiyu
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Default Questions on Health Care Reform

I know almost nothing about politics, so I just want to ask some basic questions instead of starting a debate.

Every time I hear a debate between democrats and republicans, all I can see is two groups of people fighting for power/profit, and even if one party claims how their policy will benefit the country, it must benefit their own party somehow.
And even if the policy will really benefit the country, the other party is still going to oppose because they are just fighting for power. I feel my reasoning is too simple and probably flawed, and here are my questions:

1. Does the democratic party/their interest groups benefit from the health care reform?
If yes, how? (who are their interest groups?)
If no, why would democrats strongly support the reform?

2. Does the reform hurt republicans/their interest groups?
If yes, how? (who are their interest groups?)
If no, why would republicans strongly oppose the reform?

Last edited by Huurraaa; 04-06-2010 at 03:18 AM.
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  #2  
Old 04-06-2010, 04:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Huurraaa View Post
I know almost nothing about politics, so I just want to ask some basic questions instead of starting a debate.

Every time I hear a debate between democrats and republicans, all I can see is two groups of people fighting for power/profit, and even if one party claims how their policy will benefit the country, it must benefit their own party somehow.
And even if the policy will really benefit the country, the other party is still going to oppose because they are just fighting for power. I feel my reasoning is too simple and probably flawed, and here are my questions:

1. Does the democratic party/their interest groups benefit from the health care reform?
If yes, how? (who are their interest groups?)
If no, why would democrats strongly support the reform?
Democratic interest groups include trial lawyers, labor unions, some middle class citizens (they split between Dem/GOP) and, arguably the insurance/drug industries in this single instance.

That last one's a shocker, but when you think about it as long as these industries get more profit than the reform costs them (mainly from more customers), they'll be for it. That is, opportunity cost of the reform must be less than the benefit.

Doctors and nurses (from a Hippocratic Oath standpoint) would like to be able to treat everyone for everything, though they realize practically this cannot be done. However, last I checked AMA supported the reform effort.

Trial lawyers dodged a bullet (so to speak) because there was no cap on malpractice. That's where their money comes from.

Quote:
2. Does the reform hurt republicans/their interest groups?
If yes, how? (who are their interest groups?)
If no, why would republicans strongly oppose the reform?
So far, Republican opposition hasn't been to reform as an idea so much as the method being used to accomplish the reform. Republicans believe that this package is too expensive, intrudes too much on the private sector and does not do enough to curb waste, fraud and abuse (particularly malpractice suits).

Another portion of the support/oppose is ideological (on both sides). Note that these are not necessarily logically sound but they are the arguments I've heard, nor am I making any of these arguments. This is just a non-exhaustive list.

Supporters say any of the following...
- Being the richest country in the world and the only First World nation without universal health care or something close to it is morally wrong.
- If we're going to spend large amounts of money spend it at home (caring for citizens) instead of spending it on wars.
- The insurance companies are not regulated enough and if they are costs will come down.
- Market-based reform has failed so let's try more aggressive government involvement.
- Health care is a right, not a privilege.
- Getting people off the "ER Plan" will save money.

Opponents make claims like these...
- The market would work if the government would get out of the way.
- The costs of these regulations will exceed the benefits.
- This bill adds to the deficit when we can't afford it.
- Health care is not a right, it is a privilege and the threat of not having it should motivate people to work hard enough to afford it.

I haven't covered all the arguments, feel free to add more. Again, by posting these I'm not vouching for or implying their merit.
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  #3  
Old 04-06-2010, 05:06 PM
Lord Duke the Baron
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That really clarified a lot of it for me. I tried to follow the health care debate, but it became such a pain to try to follow. Thanks mate! Tsahaylu awarded.
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  #4  
Old 04-06-2010, 05:35 PM
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There's also a lengthy (but rational and mature) discussion going on in this thread. A lot more is covered there than here. It does not directly address the question asked by Huurraaa, but there are quite a few details on the healthcare plan, arguments for and against, and some ideas on what was left out but should have been included.
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  #5  
Old 04-06-2010, 06:22 PM
Sngiyu
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Sovereign, you almost wrote an essay there. Thanks very much
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  #6  
Old 04-06-2010, 06:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sovereign View Post
Health care is not a right, it is a privilege and the threat of not having it should motivate people to work hard enough to afford it.
Health care is a right since there's people who cannot work or can't get any work until they have been cured.

Like if you have AIDS since you're a child, but your dad is missing and your mom is a prostitute. Trust me, those people exist and there is no nice in those stories.

And also, diseases are unpredictable. You might be passing through a difficult economic situation and your child has a serious accident that needs surgery. You go to the health insurance company building but they tell you "No money, no surgery". The kid dies. Very motivative stuff to get a life assurance, huh?

If everything would be as nice as "work hard and you'll get everything you want", the people working at industry or mining would be living in villas.

My two cents. Sorry for going off topic but I felt the urge of replying to that.
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Last edited by ZenitYerkes; 04-06-2010 at 06:45 PM.
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  #7  
Old 04-06-2010, 10:59 PM
Sngiyu
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It's ok Zentik. I started this thread because the history of health care reform in the US looks interesting, and I posted it outside the debate forum because I'm tired of seeing policy makers spew out arguments based on moral values and ideologies when their top concern is really just money/power (I think).

I just want to know what negative effects does the democrat's health care plan have on the republican party and their interest groups. Once again, both party's crap on ideologies/morality/etc seem to be nothing but tools for swaying the supporters, so I find such debates rather pointless.

Last edited by Huurraaa; 04-06-2010 at 11:16 PM.
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