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Old 04-16-2010, 03:06 PM
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Default Mated for life.

We had a small discussion at the irc channel regarding this:
Quote:
<Sacred> On Pandora, they are mated for life
<Xynth> Ouch mating someone for life and realizing she/he's not the one
<Xynth> or simply making a drunk mistake
<Xynth> drunken*
<Fosus> Xynth, Eywa creates a life lasting emotional bond you remember ?
<Fosus>
<Xynth> She creates one if there isn't one already? 0.0
<Fosus> So once you are mated for life he/she IS the one
<Xynth> Sounds like brainwashing to me
<Xynth> XD
<Fosus> yes it is
<Sacred> That is thread worthy material
I don't remember the source (either Activist Survival Guide or some fanfic ) but I have heard that Eywa does create some kind of life lasting emotional bond between the two people.

Discuss !

Last edited by Davy Jones; 04-16-2010 at 03:20 PM.
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  #2  
Old 04-16-2010, 04:34 PM
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I think it's important to keep in mind that Eywa helps shape what people are brought together and the forces behind it. It if is not meant to be, it most likely won't.

If the possibility for mating for life arises, its Ewya that brought the two together, regardless of their state. She serves to strengthen the bonds and bring the two even closer. She's got it under control
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  #3  
Old 04-16-2010, 05:50 PM
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I have a number of things to say on this
If it is true that Eywa does create some subconscious link then this is akin to brainwashing of some sort. It is as if Eywa is forcing union between the two, but they would never realise it as they would be ecstatic with each other - no complaining.
I do not believe that this is the case, this is not what Eywa would do. Besides, at no point (as far as we know as the scene was not included) do we see Jake and Neytiri bonding with Eywa.

Quote:
We are mated before Eywa. It is done
It is only presumed that they bond with one and other. I can see no way for Eywa to have made such a link between the two without direct neural connection.

But!
If there was no such connection, what is there to keep two Na'vi together in matrimony? Would it be the Na'vi culture of duty and honour and community, that they do not wish to disrupt the way of things and will honour tradition etc? Or could it be that there is just no contemplation of leaving each other in Na'vi culture? There is no concept of a 'need' to find happiness in any part of their daily routine as they are completely at one with Nature, with Eywa. There is no need for them to feel fulfilled with anything as they are! (I'm probably just spouting rubbish, here, oh well )
The sheer difference between humanity and the Na'vi means that this is hard for us to understand them in our current, modern mindset where divorces are almost the norm. But those of us who See and also others who follow a similar path alongside Nature are slowly becoming of similar mind to the Na'vi way of life, IMO

The solution to the above question, I think at least, is that the action of tsahaylu, itself, 'links' the two on a mental level as they will share each other's thoughts and feelings on the most basic, neural level. It is hard for me to explain without it sounding as though 'when they join together, they can read each other's minds', that is not what I mean. And this is evident when Neytiri doesn't know that Jake was sent to give the Omaticaya a message.
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Old 04-16-2010, 06:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sacred Tsahaylu View Post
I can see no way for Eywa to have made such a link between the two without direct neural connection.
In the movie, Eywa was able to control at least all the animals without tsahaylu.

As for brainwashing.. I think I also read that if the two people performing tsahaylu don't "match" (don't love eachother for example) Eywa could also create a life long negative feelings between these two, so they could never be mated for life. It starts to feel like this was all in some fanfic..
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Old 04-16-2010, 06:54 PM
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Yeah, I've read that too, in various places, that if they aren't right for each other then it will be a negative experience and they will each go and find someone else.
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Old 04-16-2010, 07:23 PM
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Damn it, I need to get the Activist's Survival Guide and read the scriptment again. As for Eywa 'controlling' them, I think it was more compelling them. Semantics, but oh well
I'm not sure I like the idea of Eywa creating a negative feeling between them, it just seems..... it doesn't conform to my idea of Eywa
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Old 04-16-2010, 07:45 PM
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I don't mean an actual feeling between them, just that the actual experience of tsahaylu wouldn't be positive, so they wouldn't be mated for life.
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Old 04-17-2010, 09:31 PM
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In the ASG there is mentioned that it often does take years for the Na'vi to choose a mate. If it would be something for Eywa to decide or force it would be much easier, I guess. In my understanding, Eywa only does some kind of final check when two Na'vi establish the bond/Tsaheylu if this relationship is likely to work out. If there are strong signs against it, the Tsaheylu-experience will be a more negative one. If everything is looking good, Eywa reinforces the positive experience for the bonded Na'vi to a level, that they are now sharing a unique connection for the rest of their life. Along those lines is how I would interpret this.
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Old 04-18-2010, 08:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ash View Post
In the ASG there is mentioned that it often does take years for the Na'vi to choose a mate. If it would be something for Eywa to decide or force it would be much easier, I guess. In my understanding, Eywa only does some kind of final check when two Na'vi establish the bond/Tsaheylu if this relationship is likely to work out. If there are strong signs against it, the Tsaheylu-experience will be a more negative one. If everything is looking good, Eywa reinforces the positive experience for the bonded Na'vi to a level, that they are now sharing a unique connection for the rest of their life. Along those lines is how I would interpret this.
That sounds right Thanks
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Old 04-19-2010, 12:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Human No More View Post
I don't mean an actual feeling between them, just that the actual experience of tsahaylu wouldn't be positive, so they wouldn't be mated for life.
This is true. I think I read it in the Activists Survival Guide. I do not believe the Na'vi or brainwashed nor do I believe Eywa to be a deity of any kind. I believe Eywa is the consciousness of the planet but has no effect on individuals. The very point of Tsahaylu is to make an everlasting bond, and if the two aren't right for each other then Tsahaylu is not the perfect experience so they keep searching.
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Old 04-19-2010, 04:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xcrunner08 View Post
This is true. I think I read it in the Activists Survival Guide. I do not believe the Na'vi or brainwashed nor do I believe Eywa to be a deity of any kind. I believe Eywa is the consciousness of the planet but has no effect on individuals. The very point of Tsahaylu is to make an everlasting bond, and if the two aren't right for each other then Tsahaylu is not the perfect experience so they keep searching.
Exactly my thoughts on this.
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Old 04-24-2010, 11:02 AM
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Sorry, brain much too tired to discuss, just wanted to say that whatever and however this mated for life business works regarding Eywa and the People and such - I think it's brilliant (of course) and wish it was like that where I am!!! But I guess most of us do.
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  #13  
Old 04-25-2010, 05:55 AM
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I agree.
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Old 04-26-2010, 10:48 PM
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Since the Na'vi are "of Eywa" to begin with, the possibility of a good or bad tsahaylu experience being a defining bonding moment is inherently about their nature, and hers. The natural actions of the Na'vi are as much a part of her "will" as those of the Thanators or Titanotheres.

I have sometimes seen, occasionally, a mindset that views the Na'vi as more external to the biosphere than I feel they actually are. Eywa doesn't need to step in (by a direct connection or otherwise) to ensure the bond between two Na'vi... she is already there.
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  #15  
Old 05-14-2010, 07:51 PM
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A lot of stars have to align each time leadership passes to a new generation. Olo'ektan has has to be the best warrior (and also trained to lead in peacetime); Tsahik has to be the best tsahik; and they have to love each other, they have to be one to act as one. I think the People count on Eywa to get all those ducks in a row.

Remember Neytiri was betrothed to Tsu'tey, but didn't want him? I think that not even Eywa can legislate love.

Last edited by joeylovesgaia; 05-14-2010 at 07:53 PM.
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