Does anyone feel that the story was a bit too obvious? - Tree of Souls - An Avatar Community Forum
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Old 12-23-2010, 07:53 PM
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Default Does anyone feel that the story was a bit too obvious?

This is just my opinion. You guys may not agree with it and may have something to say about, and that's fine. But I am entitled to believe what I want unless compelled otherwise.

As Woodsprite said somewhere, the plot of Avatar is just "in your face." There is almost no analytical thought process involved in understanding the story. I may be biased in my views because I watched Avatar so many times, but I feel that any person watching Avatar for the first time would fully understand the story, and maybe even know how story would progress before finishing the movie. Although that doesn't make the movie any less enjoyable, I would personally prefer to have a more story that is less predictable and requires more thinking to truly comprehend. Think of the story of Inception. I thoroughly enjoyed that movie because it really got me thinking about how the plot worked, even though it took me two viewings to fully understand.

What do you guys think of the plot? Is it too simple? Is it just right?
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Old 12-23-2010, 08:15 PM
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Well, while it would have been nice to see a bit more complex story, it worked out anyway perfect

So to say... It was just the right amount to make a brilliant and moving movie
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Old 12-23-2010, 10:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AC130StandingBy View Post
I may be biased in my views because I watched Avatar so many times, but I feel that any person watching Avatar for the first time would fully understand the story, and maybe even know how story would progress before finishing the movie.
I still remember very well my first experience. As for the story and the world, I was left with a bunch of questions demanding answers. But the plot: In the middle of the movie it becomes quite clear that the only "happy end" would be that Jake can continue living with the Na'vi and Na'vi would win humans. So my expectations, that were correct, were all based on the hope for this obvious "only happy end there could be". Everyone can and will come up with this, and in the end be correct.Even though my hope-based expectations of the ending were correct,

However, they made it look absolutely impossible. When Quaritch tells Jake he's gonna be on shuttle tonight I couldn't find any way it could have a happy or even bearable end. The next 30 minutes weren't any better.. just still desperately hoping the Na'vi could win. Who expected Jake to become a Toruk makto btw? There were so many dead-ends in the story, forcing audience to reconsider what to expect that I don't think anyone could know what's going to be the major thing to happen next.

Ending can be predicted, but simple it is not.
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Old 12-23-2010, 11:11 PM
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Well I see the plot (especially for movies like this) as distractions. Sure it's entertaining and gripping to have a plot you're trying to work out but for an adventure, an experience such as this, there's no need. It'd take away from the awe of it all.

When you're on a rollarcoaster, you don't think about what's going to happen next or what twist is in store, you just sit back and enjoy the ride. If you're on top of a mountain, amazed at the scenery in front of you, your mind isn't going to be thinking of anything else except what you're experiencing at that moment. The same holds true for Avatar.
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Old 12-23-2010, 11:54 PM
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EDIT - DoP already used the roller coaster anaolgy.
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Old 12-24-2010, 12:24 AM
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The plot is simple and fairly predictable (although the question of who lives and who dies is in doubt right to the very end--you have to remember what Cameron did to Jack in "Titanic"). But the plot, the struggle of good people against injustice, is so fundamental to our culture, so primal in its origins that you can hardly ask for better. There are a thousand other stories that have taken that basic theme but few have used it so well as Avatar.
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Old 12-24-2010, 12:35 AM
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i thought the story worked perfect for what they wanted to share, could it have been better yes, but then anything can be better. regardless i loved the story and would not have changed it for anything
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Old 12-24-2010, 12:42 AM
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It was very simple. However, it can be seen like a video game.

Simple plot, great gameplay, awesome graphics.
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Old 12-24-2010, 12:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Advent View Post
It was very simple. However, it can be seen like a video game.

Simple plot, great gameplay, awesome graphics.
More than half of the video-game genre want a word with you.
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Old 12-24-2010, 01:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isard View Post
More than half of the video-game genre want a word with you.
Genres.

The video gaming empire will never be all one together. Some like pc, some like consoles. Some like strategy (like myself), some like action.

But you see, nearly everyone likes Avatar. That's where my analogy stops.
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Old 12-24-2010, 03:07 AM
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Well, I did say the message was in your face (the environmental undertones were literally flying off the screen into my eyes), but the plot... well, maybe a little. But I don't really like trying to figure out movies in advance to what I'm seeing for the first time. Maybe if I was critically watching the film when I first saw it, I probably would've guessed what would happen.

But as a watcher for entertainment value rather than plot value, I didn't catch much that others did. In fact when I left the theater, I kept talking to my sister about how original it looked. I'm a movie buff. I've watched over a thousand films in my time. I wasn't really thinking about what similarities there might've been to other films because I was blown away by how well every element was conveyed: the effects, the story, the love interest, the montage in the middle, the action, the dramatic moments. It just worked.
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Old 12-24-2010, 03:09 AM
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Plenty of twists, I wasn't expecting the marines to all get killed by 'angtsik
I wasn't actually expecting Hometree to actually be destroyed first time either
Or Max's part in helping (which sadly most of wasn't included ).

Plenty of unexpected parts, while the OVERALL storyline - 99% of films can be reduced to an extremely similar (to each other) storyline if you just generalise a bit and skip over detail. Is that a bad thing? No.
I'm the guy who reads books and can predict what will happen, usually with at least some accuracy, and I often make correct guesses when watching mystery-type things (sometimes incorrect, but nobody can predict perfectly ) even without actually watching/reading something while specifically trying to pick up on hints, but I was surprised by various twists in Avatar.
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Old 12-24-2010, 05:05 AM
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Most people call it simple because they know how it would end; however, take a look at Titanic. You know how it will end. The ship obviously sinks yet it is still generally considered a good movie.

From the beginning, you can immediately tell that something bad will happen as a result of Jake's mission. The conflict of the story may be apparent from the start but I loved it still because you do not know how he will maneuver himself out of the situation. It creates a sense of foreboding dread. Throughout the movie, the scenes between Jake and Neytiri left me with this nagging feeling, "What about your mission?" Jake, for the most part, ignores it. This is his flaw and it comes to haunt him the moment before he meets Quaritch again.

Sitting in the cinema that first time seeing Jake admit his purpose in front of Neytiri, all I could think about was "Wow... you messed that up!" And then after hometree fell , I had no clue how in the world Jake would redeem himself. Even after he escaped from Hell's Gate, I still thought, "Now what?" I had no idea he was going to become Toruk Makto.

I didn't know Grace was going to die. I actually thought she would live and the mind transfer ceremony would be succesful. I could instantly deduce that Jake would later undergo somehting similar but I was so shocked that it didn't work. I thought it was going to play out as if she lived, everyone would become inspired, and all would be well before the final battle. But it didn't turn out that way.

As for the final battle, I had already correctly suspected that Eywa would indeed intervene; however, not that late into the battle. I didn't expect so many of the characters to "fall." Trudy died, Tsu'tey died, and Norm was shot. In fact, after they died, I wondered if Eywa would intervene at all. The scene after the fight between Jake and Quaritch also surprised me. I was very scared that Jake was actually going to die of suffocation.

in short: complexity =/= predictability

The main plot can be predictable but it is how you tell the story that truly defines whether it will endure in our minds.

Last edited by Banefull; 12-24-2010 at 05:33 AM.
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Old 12-24-2010, 06:15 AM
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Actually, the only plot point I didn't call was Grace dying. I suppose I should have picked up on that with the "dying to get samples" line, but really, I wasn't expecting it. Kinda out of the blue.

((But then again, that my just be me, picking apart movie plots is what I do. I even called Jake using the leaf thing to get down, "oh, he's falling, cue soopar banana leaves" and so it was))

But meh, simple plot, lots of shiny new graphics and the 3D thing. Those are what JC risked the film on. Innovative tech, rather than a necessarily innovative plot.
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Old 12-24-2010, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Banefull View Post
Most people call it simple because they know how it would end; however, take a look at Titanic. You know how it will end. The ship obviously sinks yet it is still generally considered a good movie.

From the beginning, you can immediately tell that something bad will happen as a result of Jake's mission.
A good point here! From the beginning it's clear that the **** will fall on him at some point. It creates a distressing feeling covered by the awesomeness of his new life. Then it all collapses on me in the end and I love it. This kind of plot unleashes all emotions. Dances with wolves has a similar plot and it's in the second place right after Avatar in my favorite movies list.

Like OP said, Inception had a very complicated plot, but it's way different movie. A good plot doesn't make me join any fan forum, emotions will.
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