Do the additional CE scenes make Selfridge more evil? - Tree of Souls - An Avatar Community Forum
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Old 12-29-2010, 02:31 AM
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Default Do the additional CE scenes make Selfridge more evil?

The way most thought about it before was that he wasn't so evil, as he was under pressure from his bosses and he didn't want it to end like it did (war), after all there was a deleted scene that kinda proved it, when he wanted to stop the attack on the tree of souls, but Quaritch threatened him. But as seen in CE, Grace said that they intentionally destroyed the tree of voices to trigger a reaction... The only one who could have order this was Selfridge, because I don't think Earth HQ would know about such place and Quaritch probably can't order the dozers what to run over.
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Old 12-29-2010, 04:16 AM
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I kind of thought of him to be less evil after the deleted scenes. It shows Quaritch threatening him and a few other things I caught that showed somewhat reluctance to the way things were going.

But about Grace saying they attacked the trees on purpose. That could be true, but it could also be true to say that Grace was very upset and had to point a finger at somebody and Selfridge was it. The trees could have been in line with the road that the dozers were taking to get to hometree. Many possibilities here. But all in all, from the deleted scenes I saw many of them showing Selfridge to be less evil.
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Old 12-29-2010, 04:43 AM
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Grace seemed in a fit of anger. She has no idea what goes on behind the scenes, and then she just assumes there's some sort of conspiracy behind it all. Selfridge did what he did when he thought it was best. The war, however, was not his idea. I think that pretty much exonerates Selfridge from any Na'vi killed in battle. He didn't want a slaughter, and during Hometree's destruction he assumed Quaritch would wait until all the Na'vi were out. That's why he even agreed with Quaritch to attack in the first place, since he trusted him when he said, "It'll be humane... more or less."

That, however, was when Selfridge's judgement went terribly wrong, when he trusted Quaritch to taking matters into his own hands with Hometree.
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Old 12-29-2010, 05:05 AM
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The new scenes cast him in a slightly better light; however, he is far from blameless. He knew what was happening. He was following orders from his superiors to ensure that the "unobtanium must flow" and still put in place some rather questionable policies (think about the bulldozer). In the confrontation between Selfridge and Quaritch, Quaritch's takeover stopped all mining as the miners were drafted. Selfirdge didn't want a war because that would put the whole operation at risk.

You see him oscillate between the orders of his superiors and his conscience but it ultimately leads to his downfall.
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Old 12-29-2010, 07:14 AM
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This is an interesting interpretation. I really don't know if it was Selfridge that deliberately bulldozed the Tree of Voices to provoke a response though. I'll have to watch some of the CE and deleted scenes to check.
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Old 12-29-2010, 07:08 PM
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No matter your thoughts, taking part in such atrocities instead of fighting against them means you are part of them.
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Old 12-29-2010, 08:10 PM
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so I watched deleted scenes and (they FFFing ROCK BTW ) I think I have made the assumption too early, it's clear that Selfridge didn't order the dozers to destroy ToV, since they were talking about it like it was an accident.
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Old 12-29-2010, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Human No More View Post
No matter your thoughts, taking part in such atrocities instead of fighting against them means you are part of them.
Wouldn't that mean Jake was a part of it too?

Last edited by Woodsprite; 12-29-2010 at 10:18 PM.
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Old 12-30-2010, 12:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Banefull View Post
The new scenes cast him in a slightly better light; however, he is far from blameless. He knew what was happening. He was following orders from his superiors to ensure that the "unobtanium must flow" and still put in place some rather questionable policies (think about the bulldozer). In the confrontation between Selfridge and Quaritch, Quaritch's takeover stopped all mining as the miners were drafted. Selfirdge didn't want a war because that would put the whole operation at risk.

You see him oscillate between the orders of his superiors and his conscience but it ultimately leads to his downfall.

Those Scenes made the RDA Look even more heartless and selfridge only loyal to the corparotion. To me, thoses scenes showed he was just a weasel hiding behind his desk while Quartch and the milltary did all the dirty work which protected his statues. I think "Your a long way from earth" showed that selfridge didn't want the war because he thought that Quartech sending his workers and mining equipment to a reackless charge would be costly. I think the deleded scenes emphissed that he truly had a heart of gold. And that heart of gold was broken when Max gave him the finger and we clearly see selfridge hiding behind his desk, as a coweredly weasal.
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Old 12-30-2010, 12:53 AM
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I think if Selfridge didn't have the corporation to worry about, he'd help Jake. He may not believe Grace in all the Eywa stuff, but he still knows the Na'vi are people nonetheless.
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Old 12-30-2010, 09:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodsprite View Post
Wouldn't that mean Jake was a part of it too?
Initially, yes. He didn't tell the Na'vi what he was supposed to do. He gave the marines details of Hometree. He did learn, but not quickly enough to mean that he had no fault of his own.
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Old 12-31-2010, 03:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodsprite View Post
I think if Selfridge didn't have the corporation to worry about, he'd help Jake. He may not believe Grace in all the Eywa stuff, but he still knows the Na'vi are people nonetheless.
I Don't Know, He did call them blue monkeys and fly bitin savages. I don't think that he beleved they were people because "Savages" is to dehumanize. Like in the servival guide, the na'vi are more human and posses more humanity than most RDA executives. If he had a problem with the corporation and he truly wanted to help the Na'vi, he wouldn't have been marched on the Shuttle back to earth. He had a heart of gold, that's where I stand.
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Old 01-01-2011, 12:51 AM
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In my mind, with all the scenes, Selfridge was just as much to blame as Quaritch. The dozer scene where he pushes the control forward to get Jake out of the way shows how he had the interest of the company foremost. He didn't care about the trees, he only cared about the company and making sure that the mine was not threatened. He is a corporate weasel to be sure. I think leaving out the scene where he's hiding behind the desk as Max attacks the tower changed the direction of the character a bit far.
There are several instances where he is only thinking of profit and his salary. When things start going awry and he sees the destruction of Hometree, I think he does start having a bit of a conscience, but only a small one.
Although his look that he gives Jake at the end as he's walking by can be interpreted either as 'you win this time' or 'sorry it ended this way'. I'm still trying to figure it out.

In any case... maybe the novel coming up is going to explain his frame of mind more.
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Old 01-01-2011, 04:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrice Maire View Post
In my mind, with all the scenes, Selfridge was just as much to blame as Quaritch. The dozer scene where he pushes the control forward to get Jake out of the way shows how he had the interest of the company foremost. He didn't care about the trees, he only cared about the company and making sure that the mine was not threatened. He is a corporate weasel to be sure. I think leaving out the scene where he's hiding behind the desk as Max attacks the tower changed the direction of the character a bit far.
There are several instances where he is only thinking of profit and his salary. When things start going awry and he sees the destruction of Hometree, I think he does start having a bit of a conscience, but only a small one.
Although his look that he gives Jake at the end as he's walking by can be interpreted either as 'you win this time' or 'sorry it ended this way'. I'm still trying to figure it out.

In any case... maybe the novel coming up is going to explain his frame of mind more.
Bingo. He is as much as a son of a b**** as Quaratch. "The Driving range" reaveled that while the emotional battle with grace and Jake was raging and lives were shown to be lost, he is just swinging his putt. leaving out "Avatars attack" realy leaves out a character point because he was just a cowered running the operation behind his desk. And in the end, he ended up behind his desk scared.
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Old 01-01-2011, 04:59 PM
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Exactly... I really wish they had left that in, it's disappointing he didn't get ANY of what was coming to him at all in the released versions , although I think even with the deleted scenes, he still deserved to die.
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