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-   -   How will Grace Return? (http://www.tree-of-souls.com/sequel_discussion/2794-how_will_grace_return.html)

Banefull 10-07-2010 06:12 PM

How will Grace Return?
 
How do you think Grace will return in the sequels? A lot of us have been speculating and I have seen plenty of ideas thrown around. Some have been saying that Grace will appear in a dream, others have said she will appear as an apparition, and others have said in her actual Navi Avatar. Will she even return in the second movie at all?

What are your thoughts?

Tsawke`Iheyu 10-07-2010 06:38 PM

argh, it's 50/50 :shoop: Yes, I definetly think that Grace will return as a force, as a "pure spirit", not as a being, because her soul perished before being transfered into the Na'Vi body. And one of the attempts of Eywa after Grace died is at the end when the deity fights back, probably a similar thing happened in the time of the First Songs.

Elyannia 10-07-2010 06:41 PM

The third one would be pretty badass. Lol

Patrice Maire 10-07-2010 06:42 PM

That is a toughie because I get the feeling that it will not be like an 'Obi Wan' apparition, and saying 'dream' is not quite right either. More like when Jake connects with the Tree of Souls he will be able to 'talk' to her or she to him. OR another Tree of Voices for the connection.
So... we never saw her Avatar body actually buried either.... it would be a total shock to have Jake be visiting the school or somewhere else totally random and she shows up. Or Moat comes to him and says, 'Jzake...you must come. There is someone to see you....' (I spelled his name that way because that's the way she says it...hehehe)

So yeah..it's up in the air how she may or may not come back.

txen 10-07-2010 09:26 PM

If Grace's avatar wakes up I have a feeling that it will be a Grace/Ewya hybrid and not just Grace.

Human No More 10-08-2010 09:37 PM

Her avatar is still there, she'll return to that... maybe she'll have gained more knowledge, but it will be her. I doubt Eywa would ever appear physically or communicate directly.

Banefull 11-03-2010 03:50 AM

One important thing to note is that if the sequel takes place a few years after the first film, would Grace's Avatar be able to survive in a vegetative state for that long? Is there a way to keep it healthy for an extended period of time?

Isard 11-03-2010 03:52 AM

I'm thinking along the "apparition" line. (simply based on the "remember, she's not technically dead" comment) The Grace/Eywa hybrid in Grace's avatar idea is certainly an interesting one...

Rainbowhawk1993 11-03-2010 02:12 PM

If she died, Eywa wouldn't put here back in her avatar shell 5 years after. eather in dreams or as an apparition seems to be the more reasonable way.

Banefull 11-03-2010 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banefull (Post 108075)
One important thing to note is that if the sequel takes place a few years after the first film, would Grace's Avatar be able to survive in a vegetative state for that long? Is there a way to keep it healthy for an extended period of time?

Upon some further thought, I realized that there still is the remnants of Hell's Gate. The scientists and other drivers chosen to stay may be able to store the avatar in an old amnio tank. I would imagine that they would like to keep it for sentimental purposes.

Human No More 11-03-2010 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banefull (Post 108075)
One important thing to note is that if the sequel takes place a few years after the first film, would Grace's Avatar be able to survive in a vegetative state for that long? Is there a way to keep it healthy for an extended period of time?

I'd say yes. Even after a few years, it should still survive since it seems that when not connected, they are in what seems like a state of deep hibernation and minimal process to the point that even basic functions like breathing are very low, as with no neural activity other than maintaining control of autonomic functions, there is little energy requirement, especially if the hibernation extends to a cellular level. She would certainly be weak at first after a few years, but could easily recover with time. Of course,putting it in an amnio talk would be no problem either, especially with Max and various other scientists still around :)

BotanicalMedley 02-25-2011 08:23 AM

Well, there would be no reason to keep Grace's avatar if they think she can't be "put" back into it, which is probably the case. I think her avatar would deteriorate because it's staying in a vegitative state without any nutrients for several years, since it's most likely buried. I see no way they could have gotten it back to Hell's Gate, being in the predicament they were in. But they could have gotten it there after the war... But for what purpose? To make more avatars using the DNA?

Ugh. I'm talking to much. My point is this: If Grace doesn't return in her Avatar body in the second or third film, and it's been confirmed she WILL return, maybe she'll be put in another body? Like an ikran body... Or be reincarnated entirely. I know that's a crazy thought, but this is a science fiction film, and this is EYWA who has Grace, so anything can happen.

Woodsprite 02-25-2011 08:44 AM

Well... the scientists have studied quite a lot concerning the nature of Eywa, and its abilities. I'd go with a former theory of Grace's body being kept alive. You know, just in case. :P

Sure, to most everyone's knowledge, Grace can't return in her Avatar. But since the RDA is gone, what's the purpose of some of the other scientists-as-avatars staying on Pandora? There's really nothing for them to do except to discover more things. Keeping Grace's avatar alive wouldn't be much of a problem for them.

My idea is, maybe Grace has taken a much longer period to "pass through the eye of Eywa". In other words, since Grace was weak at the time of transfer, maybe it just takes a longer time to transfer "badly-damaged information".

There may be a point in the sequel where Jake starts thinking about this very same concept, takes Grace's vegetative avatar to the Tree of Souls again, makes a tsaheylu with one of the roots of the tree, and uses all his strength and effort to try and find Grace while passing through the eye of Eywa himself to bring her back to her avatar. He's logically the only one on Pandora who has a chance of surviving this, since he's done it before.

This concept reminds me very much of Dune, how Muad'dib became the powerful one he was ultimately destined to be by putting himself directly into the Bene Gesserit's trance, and traveling to "the place they cannot go".

Perhaps Jake will attempt this very act: trying to bring Grace back, succeeding, and in the process, becoming more powerful than anyone had imagined before, perhaps wielding the ability to... dare I say it... more or less control the will of Eywa. Or maybe not. Maybe he'll have a special connection with Eywa that no other Na'vi soul possesses. Perhaps he will become their prophet; the Na'vi's "chosen one".

Human No More 02-25-2011 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodsprite (Post 130518)
Well... the scientists have studied quite a lot concerning the nature of Eywa, and its abilities. I'd go with a former theory of Grace's body being kept alive. You know, just in case. :P

Sure, to most everyone's knowledge, Grace can't return in her Avatar. But since the RDA is gone, what's the purpose of some of the other scientists-as-avatars staying on Pandora? There's really nothing for them to do except to discover more things. Keeping Grace's avatar alive wouldn't be much of a problem for them.

My idea is, maybe Grace has taken a much longer period to "pass through the eye of Eywa". In other words, since Grace was weak at the time of transfer, maybe it just takes a longer time to transfer "badly-damaged information".

There may be a point in the sequel where Jake starts thinking about this very same concept, takes Grace's vegetative avatar to the Tree of Souls again, makes a tsaheylu with one of the roots of the tree, and uses all his strength and effort to try and find Grace while passing through the eye of Eywa himself to bring her back to her avatar. He's logically the only one on Pandora who has a chance of surviving this, since he's done it before.

This concept reminds me very much of Dune, how Muad'dib became the powerful one he was ultimately destined to be by putting himself directly into the Bene Gesserit's trance, and traveling to "the place they cannot go".

Perhaps Jake will attempt this very act: trying to bring Grace back, succeeding, and in the process, becoming more powerful than anyone had imagined before, perhaps wielding the ability to... dare I say it... more or less control the will of Eywa. Or maybe not. Maybe he'll have a special connection with Eywa that no other Na'vi soul possesses. Perhaps he will become their prophet; the Na'vi's "chosen one".

Now that is a really interesting concept - I like it. After all, if grace's memories are in the network, it would still be possible to separate/copy them to the body at a later time - possibly, her injury means they because more diffuse and have spread out through the network, which is why they did not transfer to her avatar, but they could still be reintegrated in that case.

BotanicalMedley 02-27-2011 02:32 AM

:shock: .......I never even thought of that. Wow. That could definately happen. I hope it happens... DANG, that would make one awesome, crazy movie. *sigh* But we can only hope that James Cameron puts something like that in. Unless he were to come across this, or if one of us were to interview him and ask him about it, and we plant the idea in his head(is he allowed to use fan ideas?...), if he hasn't thought of it already. He's the type to put stuff like that in, and it would make sense for Norm, or one of the other scientists to think of something like that. If that DOES get put in the movie, I'll react like this: :shock: :shoop: :shoop::shoop::shoop::shoop::shoop::'(:'((crying in happiness) and then I'll pass out.

You wonder why the scientists would stay on Pandora. Why would they want to go back to Earth? It's a dead place that's a breeding ground for despair and crime. And everyone is constantly struggling to survive, and ONLY survive, not live because they can't live. The scientists on Pandora probably have never seen a large cluster of trees or animals before, if any at all. It's no doubtedly the most amazing, beautiful, real, peacefull, and PURE place they've ever been. Why would they want to leave?

Also, they'd actually be able to discover things, which they wouldn't be able to on Earth because everything that could even be STUDIED is gone.


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