Some Thought for the Mind

[The Man in Black]

I just stumbled across my definition of religion in the most ironic of places. Through reading the book Witness a popular anti-communist (and largely bigoted book which was a leading force of the "Red Scare" in the 1950s), I came across this quote: "By ex-Communists I do not mean those who break with Communism over differences of strategy and tactics (like Trotsky) or organization (like Tito). Those are merely quarrels over a road map by people all of whom are in a hurry to get to the same place."

So here I assert my personal definition of religion: "Mere quarrels over a road map by people all of whom are in a hurry to get to the same place."

[Icu]

Well, some religious people think that they are going to be reborn in the next life (and so on). Others think they'll go to heaven and whatnot.

In this way they aren't trying to get to the same place.

From another viewpoint, religion is, on the whole, an attempt to connect with something beyond the scope of humanity. I say on the whole that looking at it like this your definition fits, but you could always find certain religions that have views where it wouldn't.

[The Man in Black]

Originally Posted by Icu

an attempt to connect with something beyond the scope of humanity.

I was referring along these lines, not in the sense of "heaven." I think it applies to our natural desire for spirituality.

[Icu]

Okay, but I'm saying that "spirituality" can be so different for people in different religions that it might not be fair to say they are trying to get to the same place.

Unless that place is just any sort of connection with something beyond humanity at all.

[The Man in Black]

Originally Posted by Icu

Okay, but I'm saying that "spirituality" can be so different for people in different religions that it might not be fair to say they are trying to get to the same place.

Unless that place is just any sort of connection with something beyond humanity at all.

You're taking "same place" in the most literal of ways. What is the ultimate goal of religion to you?

Is it not to seek some form of salvation?

[Woodsprite]

I'm not aiming for 72 virgins, becoming nothingness, or dying and returning as a deer, frog, or offspring of Brad and Angelina.

Yes, there's a big difference.

[Icu]

Yeah that's what I meant, "some place" is so vague. You could interpret it in too many different ways.

[Ashen Key]

I recently came across a definition of religion that I really liked, too - it seemed to cover most things. From the book No god but God: The Origins, Evolution, and Future of Islam by Reza Aslan:

Religion, it must be understood, is not faith. Religion is the story of faith. It is an institutionalized system of symbols and metaphors (read rituals and myths) that provides a common language with which a community of faith can share with each other their numinous encounter with the Divine Presence

I'd quibble slightly on the 'institutionalized' bit, but it's a definition I quite like, and seems to cover most, if not all, religions.

[Spock]

I think spirituality is important in order to maintain purpose; in saying that the institutionalization of religion is generally a bad thing and merely a mode of control. That is why I dissocate with religious institutions and I'm contented with that.

[The Man in Black]

Originally Posted by Ashen Key

I recently came across a definition of religion that I really liked, too - it seemed to cover most things. From the book No god but God: The Origins, Evolution, and Future of Islam by Reza Aslan:



I'd quibble slightly on the 'institutionalized' bit, but it's a definition I quite like, and seems to cover most, if not all, religions.

Originally Posted by Icu

Yeah that's what I meant, "some place" is so vague. You could interpret it in too many different ways.

Originally Posted by Spock

I think spirituality is important in order to maintain purpose; in saying that the institutionalization of religion is generally a bad thing and merely a mode of control. That is why I dissocate with religious institutions and I'm contented with that.

Yeah, I agree. I think the key to unity among religions is understanding that each religion is a roadmap or "story" like you said. Although each religion has a different journey, similar goals are entitled to the "destination" aspect.

[Human No More]

I would agree that it's people working towards the same goal, only that that goal is a form of mind control, either controlling or being controlled.

[Ashen Key]

Originally Posted by Human No More

I would agree that it's people working towards the same goal, only that that goal is a form of mind control, either controlling or being controlled.

*sighs* It's really not. Religion can be USED as mind control, yes, but at its heart, it's really not. It's....community, I suppose, and all the rituals and rites and prayers that a community of the faithful share as part of their community. In a lot of ways, to actually get to the core of religion IN ITSELF, you kinda have to stop looking at things such as the Catholic Church as the institution in Rome, and start looking at what the average Catholic does that makes them similar to the average Muslim, or the average Wiccan.

[ballju]

Originally Posted by Human No More

I would agree that it's people working towards the same goal, only that that goal is a form of mind control, either controlling or being controlled.

Religion in of itself is not used for mind control it's is at its core a set of believes towards how to be saved. Its a group of people that share the same ideology. I'm going to quote Karl Marx as he is one of the people that works influence my life. It can be and it is however Religion in itself isn't.

Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is the demand for their real happiness. To call on them to give up their illusions about their condition is to call on them to give up a condition that requires illusions.

[Woodsprite]

^What a wonderful, thoughtful way to put it, HNM. I'm guessing you were really trying to strain yourself from saying that (like you've told me so many times how much you "try so hard"), but like all struggles, not everything can be won. Pity.

[Human No More]

A bit like you with your comparisons to Hitler made in absence of a real argument?

As your sig states, things need to be questioned before they should be held to be true.