Neytiri - a message

[Tiberius]

Originally Posted by Human No More

If someone is exactly like you, they are neither an inspiration nor a role model.

I haven't disowned humans. I just wish to be something more. Those views are a world apart. Yes, I dislike the way the majority of humans are, but I still think that people COULD change if they had the chance.

If you think that being a Na'vi would make you into 'something more', then You are every bit as blind and deluded as the world which you criticise. Calling yourself 'Human no More' and going on about Neytiri does not mean you have changed, it just means you became self-absorbed and self-righteous. Change is something much deeper. It implies a paradigm shift. You still seem to carry a lot of anger, resentment and a limited view of spirituality which you need to let go of.

I'm sure 98% of people here could assure you of my loyalty to the people I care about - the people here, my family, and a small group of AFK friends. I would do just about anything to keep them happy, together, safe. If anyone hurt them, I would hurt that person back because while there aren't MANY things I may care about that much, what there is is that important to me.

Being loyal to family and friends does not mean you have not disowned the human race. It is easy to be nice to family and friends and then dispise the rest of the world. A genuine human being cares about the whole world, not just their family and friends. After-all even serial killers, and dictators are nice to their family and friends, and yet treat everyone else with contempt.

Eywa and human concepts of 'god' are completely different ideas. Eywa is not some superbeing who creates life but an EMBODIMENT of the interconnectedness of life on Pandora. Everything about Eywa is physically possible, as she is basically a nervous system on a geological scale.

This is your own typically materialistic/Non-Spiritual interpretation of Eywa we have all heard too many times.

Eywa doesn't ask for mindless devotion like most human religions, but is a physical being. the Na'vi do not wish for good things to happen to them, they know that as part of Pandora, Eywa is dedicated to balance. They aren't coerced by fear of punishment, but driven by their own experience.
There's a difference between being spiritual and blind faith.

Human religions are nothing to do with mindless devotion. You need to educate yourself on religion. Eywa is not only physical, stop putting your materialistic world view on everything.

I guess that in a way, I am 'spiritual' despite not believing in the paranormal (not that I'd say that to most people because they would misunderstand, but I think people here will get what I mean ), in terms of what I think about things like love, or even happiness, or just the human need for company. There's no need to believe in an invisible being or force to do that.

All humans are spiritual to a point. Its just that some are spiritual dwarves and some are spiritual Giants. Neytiri, being a future Tsahik and being devoted to Eywa is heading towards being a spiritual giant, like Mo'at. There are too many spiritual dwarves who think they deserve Neytiri. Jake started off as a spiritual dwarf, but by the end of the film he was a Spiritually developed man, on his knees Praying to a Deity, and his prayer saved the day in the end.

Me, for one. There was a thread on learnnavi forums about 'what would it be like if the Na'vi were non-humanoid' and I said there that truthfully, we can't control who we fall in love with. If there was an alien species who were physically different from humans and I met them and fell in love with one, I would hold that as important as I would love of anyone else.

If you were capable of that kind of love you would not be so angry at the world would you.

I stand by what I said earlier. There is something wrong when people who are far from perfect, think they deserve someone who is perfect. I do not believe Neytiri would be even remotely interested in most people here.

Part of the reason why Neytiri chose Jake was because he had a "Strong Heart" - he did not go around complaining that he did not have a life mate or complaining about his legs, he just got on with life. He was also a prayerful, and selfless man by the end of the film, which is more than can be said for most people here.

Inspiration doesn't need to be complete, people cab be inspired by aSPECTS or someoen or something and it's just as valid. Neither do people need to COMPLETELY change.Inspiration doesn't need to be complete, people cab be inspired by aSPECTS or someoen or something and it's just as valid. Neither do people need to COMPLETELY change.

Jake's transformation was almost total. That is why he won Neytir's heart. Unless a person is willing to transform almost totally, then they will never amount to much, spiritually. The old self dies, the new self awakes. One life ends another begins.

[neytirifanboy]

@Tiberius - The things you said about Neytiri there were impressive. You could done a fantastic commentary yourself with the material you used in both your posts. Although I agree with much of what you say, I am not sure your criticism of others is warranted or indeed necessary. In fact, what you, and indeed others, say about Neytiri is valid, stands up on its own and has more impact without referring to others, whether it be individual members or a group of members of on TOS.

The truth is that people will see Neytiri in many defferent ways depending on the their own beliefs and circumstances. The fact that so many different people can see Neytiri positively in their own way is a good thing. It just shows how meaningful the character of Neytiri truly is. I think it may be unfair and presumptuous for anyone to make judgements about anyone's else spirituality based on how they see Neytiri or frankly anything else they write here or elsewhere on the internet. I know that I am not in a position, either moral or intellectual, to judge anyone here, either positively or negatively.

I think it is a shame parts of this thread have descended into some sort of bizarr cat-fight between HMN and Tiberius as to who knows Neytiri more. It puts fan-boys like me to shame. I am sure Elu created theis thread with sole reason of making people feel good about Neytiri and themselves. It was not supposed engender a conflictual deate. I think both HNM and Tiberius (and indeed the OP Eltu) have made some very interesting and inciteful comments about Neytiri. If I take away some of the agressive debating and some personal insults, some of the stuff is truly beautiful.

Personally, I think each of us who love the character of Neytiri, should have the right to love her in their own way. And since we are on an Avatar forum, people who wish to should be allowed to openly express their admiration for a character that means a lot to them without being csubject to personal criticism, either directly or indirectly.

Personally, I loved all that was said about Neytiri because it show the diversity of her character and the diversity of those that love her.

[Sacred Tsahaylu]

Tiberius, if you would be so kind as to tone down your opinions of other people's world views. Just because HumanNoMore's do not fall into stride with your own does not make them wrong or merit talking down to him. As you say, every human is spiritual in their own way. Respect that

[neytirifanboy]

Originally Posted by Sacred Tsahaylu

Tiberius, if you would be so kind as to tone down your opinions of other people's world views. Just because HumanNoMore's do not fall into stride with your own does not make them wrong or merit talking down to him. As you say, every human is spiritual in their own way. Respect that

It is not what Tiberius said that was a probelm. A lot of what he said was exteremly interesting and inciteful. I just think it was unnecessary for him to necessarily directly disagree with the OP. Why not just make a post generally responding with his views. In some ways her ruined a really nice well-intentioned thread.

It would have added to the thread immensly if he had siimply explained his view without directly criticising the OP which wasn't necessary. And this leaqd to the direct intevention of HNM who is not always the most sublte of debaters and his views often don't coincide with many.

In fact, much of what Timerius said was so interesting, that I think it deserves in separate commentary in the "Member Commentary" section.

[Mere Human]

I'm with HNM, I'm not saying that humanity sucks, but our nature is evil, and that is something that is demostrated day after day, many people has awaken and wants to change, but is not that easy... Tiberius, I hope that all what you say, you apply it truly to yourself.