The Meaning of Life

[SaphirJD]

Perfect words Just have your life, dont care about the rest wich enslaves you Love, Money, Education, Jobs... What is all that... Human creations - Just to keep our mind going that we dont turn insane

Back to our Roots, back 2 ourselves

[Sempu]

Originally Posted by caveman

You wouldn't happen to be a Zen master, would you

A Zen master would probably say either that he wasn't a master, or that everyone was. Take your pick

The purpose of this thread was twofold. First, I find alternate ways of thinking to be fun and challenging. Secondly, this can be beneficial to other people who struggle to find meaning in life.

Whoa, you mean there's meaning in this thread?

But seriously... there is a big reminder here. So much of the time I treat things around me from a blind assumption based interpretation. Nothing wrong with that much of the time, or I'd still be figuring out how to get out of bed. But doing that all the time robs me of the joy of experiencing something completely. I just looked at the strawberry I was eating. I mean, really looked at it. And it was like, wow. That's available to everyone all the time. Even if they don't have a strawberry handy

[SaphirJD]

You have strawberries? Epic Friend, Epic

Thats what i always praying as All Knowing, All Seeing Super Villain - Trust in red Fruits, they know the truth and show you reality as it should be

[Human No More]

Originally Posted by Banefull

Though to my understanding, when most people ask about the meaning of life, they are asking why they are here to begin with or what purpose they have in the first place.

It should also be noted that the following statements have very different implications:

There is no meaning to life; therefore, make whatever you want out of your life.

The inherent meaning of life is to make whatever we want out of our lives.

Most people are actually referring to the first statement with the premise implied and this is where the confusion is coming from.

Not everyone is asking 'why', because the answer to that is clear: People are here, without a specific purpose.
The two statements are in effect interchangeable. I would rather phrase it as the first, but both reach the same end, if from different ways.

Originally Posted by Theorist

let me simplify my take on life.

it's when you're not dead.

Well said

[Banefull]

The point of what I was saying Human No More, was that there is a logical relationship between where meaning comes from and what object has it, not to actually state what it is or whether it existed in the first place. I did my best to try and stay neutral (I took an agnostic position) in a purely philosophical context but perhaps I failed in that regard.

And I will answer something you said earlier.

Originally Posted by Human No More

Having a dictated purpose that is not your own is possibly the worst way to live possible.

You equate direction with slavery. You also misunderstood a lot of what I said. I said meaning comes from a creator but did I ever say that was a being? To start with one from birth, that must be true. Maybe I wasn't clear enough but meaning can also be created from circumstance.

When I contest this notion that people create purposes and meanings for themselves, I say that purpose and meaning are things that are thrust upon you. Have you ever been in a situation where you witnessed something happen in front of you and you yourself recognized that you what you had to do? Surely if you saw someone on the street being assaulted by another human being you would recognize what you yourself must do? But you don't have to. You can choose. Purpose and meaning are callings, things which are thrust upon upon you, not something you make. And I say, following that calling will bring you happiness in this life. Pursuit of happiness isn't just freedom or the ability to do whatever you want, its the ability to pursue your own vocation and the ability to do so can include things like having freedom, enough food to eat, or even just the chance to live.

Keeping this post on track with what Caveman intended, I say that purpose and meaning can also only be realized through direct experience. You will never find it by sitting around and moping about it. You have to live life to find it. You won't create one for yourself but you can put yourself in a state of mind, being, or place where you might discover one to live out and devote your love and attention to.

And Human No More, sometimes I feel as if you go so far as to assume that religion is mental submission. I don't mean this in any angry or threatening manner, far from it. But you need to realize that some people are called to be religious.

[Sempu]

My favorite example of the dichotomy in religion is in the movie "Brother Sun, Sister Moon," about Saint Francis of Assisi. You have in Francis the essence of religion as a calling from God, meeting the Pope who is the essence of religion as an ossified dogma, and the effect of one on the other is so great that the Pope realizes he is in the presence of a truly religious man.

[Human No More]

Originally Posted by Banefull

You equate direction with slavery. You also misunderstood a lot of what I said. I said meaning comes from a creator but did I ever say that was a being? To start with one from birth, that must be true. Maybe I wasn't clear enough but meaning can also be created from circumstance.

Direction isn't slavery - being given one with no choice is almost the dictionary definition. If a 'creator' isn't a being, then it isn't a creator, unless you mean the entire ecosystem ion a very roundabout and vague way, in which case isn't it logical that the 'meaning' is simply to survive?

When I contest this notion that people create purposes and meanings for themselves, I say that purpose and meaning are things that are thrust upon you. Have you ever been in a situation where you witnessed something happen in front of you and you yourself recognized that you what you had to do? Surely if you saw someone on the street being assaulted by another human being you would recognize what you yourself must do? But you don't have to. You can choose.

In that exact situation, I made a decision. Although I did feel that I should try to help the person (and did), my first thought was self-preservation. I value myself over someone I don't even know. I wasn't told what to do by anyone.

Purpose and meaning are callings, things which are thrust upon upon you, not something you make.

You an still choose to ignore something. I assume you are talking about inspiration, and possibly even random chance. For example, if I had just turned around and run in that situation, it wouldn't have changed anything, other than a fact.

And I say, following that calling will bring you happiness in this life. Pursuit of happiness isn't just freedom or the ability to do whatever you want, its the ability to pursue your own vocation and the ability to do so can include things like having freedom, enough food to eat, or even just the chance to live.

...and that is freedom - making that choice. I don't think you understand that.

You will never find it by sitting around and moping about it. You have to live life to find it. You won't create one for yourself but you can put yourself in a state of mind, being, or place where you might discover one to live out and devote your love and attention to.

Are you implying that I don't have any idea? Because you are mistaken. My goal in life is a few things - to find a lifemate, to enjoy myself, and to help others where reasonable, but not when it is at a detriment to myself.

And Human No More, sometimes I feel as if you go so far as to assume that religion is mental submission. I don't mean this in any angry or threatening manner, far from it. But you need to realize that some people are called to be religious.

Some people are more susceptible to believe what they are told, you're right. On the other hand, if they were never told, they would never have realised that. Someone raised form birth without any mention of it is going to look at the world objectively, look for proof of statements. If you don't tell a young child about the tooth fairy or Father Christmas, they won't independently assume they exist either.

[josie20]

I find it arrogant to even ask what the meaning of life is. We're animals, just like any other. Did we develop greater intelligence, yes. But that doesn't mean we're separate, or different, from any other animal on the planet. You're here, so enjoy it(or don't). It's all up to you. We all live. We all die. Accept it for what it is.

[Icu]

Originally Posted by josie20

I find it arrogant to even ask what the meaning of life is. We're animals, just like any other. Did we develop greater intelligence, yes. But that doesn't mean we're separate, or different, from any other animal on the planet. You're here, so enjoy it(or don't). It's all up to you. We all live. We all die. Accept it for what it is.

Yeah this is more or less how I view it when it comes to talking about meaning in life. I don't think there's any inherent meaning so you're free to make whatever meaning out of it that you want.

Actually this is also in a lot of ways how I view posts about people criticizing humanity as an entire species.

[BotanicalMedley]

What is life? What is the meaning of life? Does it even have a meaning?

Life is consciousness.

What is consciousness?

Consciousness is thinking, smelling, seeing, hearing, tasting, feeling. Over all, experiencing.

What is the meaning of life?

Think of what you do from a day to day basis. You experience. Every single day, we experience, LEARN something new. It doesn't have to be something like a difficult calculous problem. It can be as simple as finding out that James Cameron posted a new tweet. It's still finding something out, and when you read that tweet, you're finding out what he thinks, or what he's been doing, etc.(this is a strange idiology, I know) But either way, you're learning something.

We learn every single day. You may think now,"But we always see the same things every single day." That's not true. We may see in general the same people, or the same roads we travel on, and the same sky, but those people are going to be wearing something different and saying different things, the roads will have different cars on them, the sky will have different clouds in it. So, we're learning that these poeple like these kinds of clothes and say these things so they have this kind of personality, this road is very popular or not so popular, these clouds look like rain clouds or the sun looks so interesting behind them. And you feel something about it.

So, this concludes that the meaning of life is for us to LEARN and EXPERIENCE, to FIGURE OUT as much as we possibly can with the time given to us.

And our life could end at any moment from anything, and that's why it's so important to live as best as we can every second of every minute of every hour of every day and so on and so forth. So when we die we don't live the rest of eternity in complete misery because we didn't live our life the way we should have.

[caveman]

Originally Posted by BotanicalMedley

What is life? What is the meaning of life? Does it even have a meaning?

Life is consciousness.

What is consciousness?

Consciousness is thinking, smelling, seeing, hearing, tasting, feeling. Over all, experiencing.

What is the meaning of life?

Think of what you do from a day to day basis. You experience. Every single day, we experience, LEARN something new. It doesn't have to be something like a difficult calculous problem. It can be as simple as finding out that James Cameron posted a new tweet. It's still finding something out, and when you read that tweet, you're finding out what he thinks, or what he's been doing, etc.(this is a strange idiology, I know) But either way, you're learning something.

We learn every single day. You may think now,"But we always see the same things every single day." That's not true. We may see in general the same people, or the same roads we travel on, and the same sky, but those people are going to be wearing something different and saying different things, the roads will have different cars on them, the sky will have different clouds in it. So, we're learning that these poeple like these kinds of clothes and say these things so they have this kind of personality, this road is very popular or not so popular, these clouds look like rain clouds or the sun looks so interesting behind them. And you feel something about it.

So, this concludes that the meaning of life is for us to LEARN and EXPERIENCE, to FIGURE OUT as much as we possibly can with the time given to us.

And our life could end at any moment from anything, and that's why it's so important to live as best as we can every second of every minute of every hour of every day and so on and so forth. So when we die we don't live the rest of eternity in complete misery because we didn't live our life the way we should have.

So could you say, in the most general term, that the meaning of life is to grow?

This was actually my conclusion for some time. I still play with the idea, although as I've stated in the thread, I'm diving into new understandings and new ways of thinking. Still, I like this conclusion you have. It seems like a mix between my old conclusion and my new one.

[Banefull]

Well Human No More, it seems as if we are doomed to disagree on such subjects , but perhaps we can still learn things from each other.

Originally Posted by Human No More

Direction isn't slavery - being given one with no choice is almost the dictionary definition. If a 'creator' isn't a being, then it isn't a creator, unless you mean the entire ecosystem ion a very roundabout and vague way, in which case isn't it logical that the 'meaning' is simply to survive?

Circumstances put in place for a reason. Call it whatever you want (we're arguing about semantics in this point anyways) but you're always free to choose against a calling. Also a creator may not necessarily be a being, it could be a force (Monism).

Originally Posted by Human No More

In that exact situation, I made a decision. Although I did feel that I should try to help the person (and did), my first thought was self-preservation. I value myself over someone I don't even know. I wasn't told what to do by anyone.

I have a question for you. Maybe I'll learn something from your answer. Have you ever felt a disconnct between your mind and your "heart?" I find that there are some things I cannot change no matter how hard I try. If I were in that situation and simply walked away, no matter how many logical justifcations I gave, no matter how much I told myself otherwise, I cannot remove that feeling that I should have at least attempted to do something. In effect, I cannot change this.

Originally Posted by Human No More

You an still choose to ignore something. I assume you are talking about inspiration, and possibly even random chance. For example, if I had just turned around and run in that situation, it wouldn't have changed anything, other than a fact.

I might find your answer to this to be rather surprising also. Should we even be concerned beyond whether it simply affects us? Do you think that actions ultimately matter or not? If not, why should we even bother to live life at all?

Originally Posted by Human No More

...and that is freedom - making that choice. I don't think you understand that.

It includes other things. If I am hungry, I cannot fully focus on a given task. In that situation, I can still make choices but I cannot fully live out my vocation.

Originally Posted by Human No More

Are you implying that I don't have any idea? Because you are mistaken. My goal in life is a few things - to find a lifemate, to enjoy myself, and to help others where reasonable, but not when it is at a detriment to myself.

I never presumed that you didn't. That wasn't pointed at anyone.

Originally Posted by Human No More

Some people are more susceptible to believe what they are told, you're right. On the other hand, if they were never told, they would never have realised that. Someone raised form birth without any mention of it is going to look at the world objectively, look for proof of statements. If you don't tell a young child about the tooth fairy or Father Christmas, they won't independently assume they exist either.

I could say the same about science and logic. Not every culture (few even) had a concept of science to begin with. Science has its own fundamental assumptions (nature is uniform, set laws can describe how nature works, etc). If someone raised from birth never had an introduction to science, he or she may not even discover it. (Now don't get me wrong, I absolutely love science and logic)

[Oliver]

i can't find the meaning with life right now. i don't thinks there is a actually meaning with life

[Muiä]

I have had this thought, that from the beginning of time, things from the tiniest molecules have combined into more complex substances which in turn created things that became the building blocks of life under the right conditions. Then life continued to evolve into more complex things which then brought about us humans with consciousness. The meaning of life is the passing of time, which is also the same as things becoming more complex. So the meaning of life is for things to grow more complex over time. We just happen to be aware of this process and because we have evolved to only see certain things (such as only being able to see into the visible light spectrum) we try to give meanings but we can only see so much. We created meaning. There is no beginning or end because we are limited to what we can see, so we may never know in our understanding of the world around us. Just experience growth whilst time passes by.

[BotanicalMedley]

(Continued from my first post)

And the meaning of life, also, is to feel the Singularity, and to understand that there is only love in it.