What Are Our Beliefs And Why?

[ZenitYerkes]

Just wanted to throw away the question.

I am agnostic, previously Christian Catholic. I base my beliefs in the questioning about everything, even the dogma. I wanted to have actual answers to the vital questions such as the "What's the meaning of life?" or "Who am I?"; and I wanted to do the quest by myself. I haven't stopped thinking over religious matters since then, so I don't consider myself the I-don't-want-to-go-mass-so-I-quit agnostic.

My thoughts about God are various and variable at this moment, so I can't really say if I'm Theist or not. However I like to think life is just a phase of something greater. A vital cycle maybe.

I'm completely open minded, I have to say; since I don't have any fundamental or dogmatic base and can adopt with ease several different postures.

[fkeua vrrtep]

On the paper I'm a christian catholic , but I never felt me a part of christianity , I find religion ridiculous , especially the world religions , I quite think it's hipocrit and worthless , like george carlin once said , religion would be good , if they would actually practice it and not only speak about it .

I think the world religions try to stupidify their peopleand keep them small and following them no matter what , the only religion I could see myself a part of is nature .

[Fkeu'itan]

I'm not sure what the term is for this, I don't believe in God per-se and I don't follow a religion. I just believe that if you are generally a kind and caring person to the world and all those you meet, you will get kindness in return. I don't think there is an afterlife or, as I have already said, a God, but I do believe there is something beneith the shell of mere chemical and scientific process, something that inexplicably binds us all together. A kind of life-force if you will...

[Human No More]

I don't have any. I'm atheist, there is no evidence for any religion, and even if there was, the state of the world just shows why it's a bad idea.

[Anima]

Originally Posted by Fkeu'itan

I'm not sure what the term is for this, I don't believe in God per-se and I don't follow a religion. I just believe that if you are generally a kind and caring person to the world and all those you meet, you will get kindness in return. I don't think there is an afterlife or, as I have already said, a God, but I do believe there is something beneith the shell of mere chemical and scientific process, something that inexplicably binds us all together. A kind of life-force if you will...

^This
I believe in energies of some kind, cause it also excist in physics ("Energy can neither be created nor destroyed. It can only change forms" and so on) so it covers my need of "science". I also believe in what you give is what you get. Maybe not always direct but in the long run.

[rapunzel77]

I actually have very strong religious beliefs. I'm a Catholic myself. I might be in a very, very tiny minority on this board . I love my faith, having come to it, not as a baby but as an adult (I'm a convert). So, I've gone the opposite direction of most of you . That being said, the reason for my conversion was that I fell in love. I actually enjoy being Catholic. I know that might seem very strange to a lot of people. It might sound weird but I have a sense of freedom in the Church. I didn't have that when I was a protestant (not to say that protestants can't be free either ). I guess it comes down to love. I chose this. No one else forced me into it. No one could.

It saddens me that it is so misunderstood though . That is the fault I believe of those who are hypocrites. I wish there weren't so many. I try to live my life properly. If the best I can do is show love to others then I am doing my best. I guess I also want to show that not everyone who calls themselves a Christian has three heads and spits fire. I know that we all encounter those sort a lot . It makes me sad. The worse part is when people within the Church act up, the bad apples, etc. They poison everything . It hurts.

[Human No More]

I do generally dislike religion, but I know that there are completely normal people who happen to follow it, and not everyone is a fundamentalist nutcase like al-quaida or the pope. I respect anyone who believes in it but doesn't let it control their lives or make decisions for them.

[Gunny]

I am Presbyterian, always gone to church. At one point I did decide to question it but in the end I came back.

[rapunzel77]

Originally Posted by Human No More

I do generally dislike religion, but I know that there are completely normal people who happen to follow it, and not everyone is a fundamentalist nutcase like al-quaida or the pope. I respect anyone who believes in it but doesn't let it control their lives or make decisions for them.

Interesting take on religion HNM. The reason why I differ is that if you are going to believe something strongly, how could it not affect your worldview and outlook on life? Perhaps it is more the case that the person freely chooses to allow themselves to be guided by their beliefs. Not in the sense of being brainwashed but in the sense of using them as a guide. I know it can seem like a fine line and perhaps one that is blurred at times.

There are fundamentalist nutcases in every religion. Its sad. Although I don't think one can place the pope in the same category as Al-Quada. I know its your opinion and I respect it. My impression of the Pope (due to the fact I have read his writings) is that he is a very intelligent man who is very nuanced in his positions. He is hardly a "fundamentalist". However, if someone has not read his stuff, etc and is only going by what is said about him in some media circles then I guess one could come to the conclusion that he is a crazy fundamentalist nutcase.

Like I said in my last post, I think there is a lot of misunderstanding and miscommunication. That can lead to fear and hatred of the other and further the wars and mistreatment of other people who are different or who believe differently.

I am happy to have this discussion because I hope that it can lead to an understanding and a respect for each other on this board since we can learn so much from each other considering that we come from very divergent backgrounds .

[Woodsprite]

Might as well post the full thing again: Conservative-Libertarian, young-earth creationist, Protestant Christian. I came to Christianity primarily because of the evidence in favor of it... so I don't know what sources HNM has been looking into to think that religions don't have any evidence for them (let alone Christianity), because the whole premise of that is an outright lie, no offense to HNM of course. My debate motto: ignorance can be fixed; stupid is forever. The evidence in favor of Christianity on a historical/scientific level are phenominal. Even the History Channel recognizes the Bible's historical accuracy.

Repeated: I'm a Christian because there's just too much evidence in favor of it. There's just... libraries of information that support it. I've debated on the subject far too long, and have learned far too much to ever think something silly like "Bible contradictions" or "scientific fallacies". It's just laughable, honestly, after what I've studied. I can't count how many acclaimed contradictions I've refuted. I've even stumped the infidels.org administrator once about that subject.

As for science, there's no doubt in my mind at all that the Bible can be considered "unscientific" after all the biologists, physicists, chemists, geologists, paleontologists, astronomers, and others I've encountered who slice the evidence out so quickly these days like a hot knife through butter makes some mighty-fine toast. Won't find anything in major scientific journals because it's being censored, and the story on that is quite interesting, and I'm not talking about Ben Stein's documentary, he discovered this way after it was happening. I've looked into... man, must be at least 15 accounts I've seen. The quotes I've heard, the actions I've seen... insert the phrase "ignorance is bliss". The less you know, the happier you are in thinking the place you live in is actually an advocate of anything related to the word "free".

Before, I'd think the exact opposite, but now it's just humorous to think otherwise.

Of course, faith does play a part in my beliefs, I believe, for instance, that Jesus died on the cross, then rose from the dead. The evidence for that event isn't really set in stone; you have to have faith to believe that. There are certain things you have to take on faith. Then there are witness accounts, but that's a whole other discussion.

EDIT: Just also wanted to add that I wish there were more Christians out there (let alone ones that believe in values like mine) would love Avatar as much as I. I hold many values in contrast to the film, but I accept the movie for what it is: a beautiful sci-fi film that touches the heart and soul. Many other Christians just don't see that, and watch it for content, rather than story.

[rapunzel77]

I'm not a young earth creationist. I believe that the earth and the universe is billions of years old and that evolution did play a role in it but that it was God who created it all. I believe that what we see in science is what happened physically on the earth and in the universe at the time of creation, etc. I truly believe that there doesn't need to be any "war" between science and religion or faith and reason. They all can go together: both/and not either/or. Science can explain very many things that the Bible can't do because the Bible isn't meant to be a "scientific" book. The Bible is, in my view, explaining who not the how. I believe that God created it but the physical way in which it happened can be explained by science.

This is my belief. I know you have a different belief on it Woodsprite. That's fine. My mom has a similar belief to yours.

Originally Posted by Woodsprite

EDIT: Just also wanted to add that I wish there were more Christians out there (let alone ones that believe in values like mine) would love Avatar as much as I. I hold many values in contrast to the film, but I accept the movie for what it is: a beautiful sci-fi film that touches the heart and soul. Many other Christians just don't see that, and watch it for content, rather than story.

I agree here. It is disheartening to see so many Christians not just disliking Avatar but also going out of their way to hate it. I have seen some good reviews from some Catholics on it, including one from a Catholic priest. Its a story. In fact, I will say its a myth. There are parallels to it to many of the greatest stories ever told which is why it is enduring. It does touch the heart and it does put a mirror up to our faces. What struck me the most after watching it was how is my attitude toward God when times get tough. I was touched by the Na'vi's trust. After Hometree was destroyed they made a pilgrimage to the Tree of Souls. They still had the belief that Ewya would provide for them. That was very touching and it is something that I can apply to my own life and my own faith in the way I should regard God. So, I want to be more like the Na'vi. To be in total communion with God, with each other, and with our environment. That is a good goal and I do not see how it can possibly contradict my faith or any other. Those are the three things that man should strive to be in communion with. It is what man was in communion with at the beginning. We have fallen since then.

I want to love more and serve others. I have done this in regard to my family, my husband, my friends but I know that I must show love to everyone else. Father gave a very good and wonderful homily on Holy Thursday. He said that all this that we have in the Church (ie. the sacraments, etc) mean nothing if we don't have charity. If we don't love then our faith is nothing. Love is everything.

[Gunny]

Very good post rapunzel! I agree with everything you said

[Grif]

I would love to still be a Catholic, but I can't. It's like seeing a ride at Disney world as a kid thinking it all worked by magic then seeing the machines running it. There is no going back for me unless I get evidence.

I hold basically the same views as Douglas Adams.

AMERICAN ATHEISTS: Mr. Adams, you have been described as a “radical Atheist.” Is this accurate?

DNA: Yes. I think I use the term radical rather loosely, just for emphasis. If you describe yourself as “Atheist,” some people will say, “Don’t you mean ‘Agnostic’?” I have to reply that I really do mean Atheist. I really do not believe that there is a god - in fact I am convinced that there is not a god (a subtle difference). I see not a shred of evidence to suggest that there is one. It’s easier to say that I am a radical Atheist, just to signal that I really mean it, have thought about it a great deal, and that it’s an opinion I hold seriously. It’s funny how many people are genuinely surprised to hear a view expressed so strongly. In England we seem to have drifted from vague wishy-washy Anglicanism to vague wishy-washy Agnosticism - both of which I think betoken a desire not to have to think about things too much.

People will then often say “But surely it’s better to remain an Agnostic just in case?” This, to me, suggests such a level of silliness and muddle that I usually edge out of the conversation rather than get sucked into it. (If it turns out that I’ve been wrong all along, and there is in fact a god, and if it further turned out that this kind of legalistic, cross-your-fingers-behind-your-back, Clintonian hair-splitting impressed him, then I think I would chose not to worship him anyway.)

Other people will ask how I can possibly claim to know? Isn’t belief-that-there-is-not-a-god as irrational, arrogant, etc., as belief-that-there-is-a-god? To which I say no for several reasons. First of all I do not believe-that-there-is-not-a-god. I don’t see what belief has got to do with it. I believe or don’t believe my four-year old daughter when she tells me that she didn’t make that mess on the floor. I believe in justice and fair play (though I don’t know exactly how we achieve them, other than by continually trying against all possible odds of success). I also believe that England should enter the European Monetary Union. I am not remotely enough of an economist to argue the issue vigorously with someone who is, but what little I do know, reinforced with a hefty dollop of gut feeling, strongly suggests to me that it’s the right course. I could very easily turn out to be wrong, and I know that. These seem to me to be legitimate uses for the word believe. As a carapace for the protection of irrational notions from legitimate questions, however, I think that the word has a lot of mischief to answer for. So, I do not believe-that-there-is-no-god. I am, however, convinced that there is no god, which is a totally different stance and takes me on to my second reason.

I don’t accept the currently fashionable assertion that any view is automatically as worthy of respect as any equal and opposite view. My view is that the moon is made of rock. If someone says to me “Well, you haven’t been there, have you? You haven’t seen it for yourself, so my view that it is made of Norwegian Beaver Cheese is equally valid” - then I can’t even be bothered to argue. There is such a thing as the burden of proof, and in the case of god, as in the case of the composition of the moon, this has shifted radically. God used to be the best explanation we’d got, and we’ve now got vastly better ones. God is no longer an explanation of anything, but has instead become something that would itself need an insurmountable amount of explaining. So I don’t think that being convinced that there is no god is as irrational or arrogant a point of view as belief that there is. I don’t think the matter calls for even-handedness at all.

[Woodsprite]

Originally Posted by rapunzel77

I'm not a young earth creationist. I believe that the earth and the universe is billions of years old and that evolution did play a role in it but that it was God who created it all. I believe that what we see in science is what happened physically on the earth and in the universe at the time of creation, etc. I truly believe that there doesn't need to be any "war" between science and religion or faith and reason. They all can go together: both/and not either/or. Science can explain very many things that the Bible can't do because the Bible isn't meant to be a "scientific" book. The Bible is, in my view, explaining who not the how. I believe that God created it but the physical way in which it happened can be explained by science.

Oh I don't object: the Bible is not a science book. My point was that when the Bible speaks on science, it's correct (if correctly read, especially taking the lexicon in mind). The Bible's more of an historical document moreso than anything.

Also, I don't think there's a "war" between science and religion, at least when talking about science and Christianity. I think there's a conflict of evolutionism and Christianity, but not science. Though, I see you (), and respect your position. On a side-note, just wondering would you call yourself a progressive creationist (others call it "old-earth" creationism)? Because by what you described it sounds like that.


EDIT: @Grif: I wrote a looooooooong article about exactly what you just said about 4 years ago, and got some exciting discussion off it in a few forums. Maybe someday I'll post it here, see what your thoughts are.

[Wanderling]

I describe myself as a non-denominational Christian. And of course, I love Avatar, too.

I will admit, I'm a little wimpy in sharing my beliefs; there is a lot of misunderstanding and assuming that all Christians, any denomination, is going to shove it down their throats (not without reason, unfortunately ). It has been a rather strange turn of events that I find myself most comfortable talking religion with Pagans and Wiccans.

I suppose the "why" of my beliefs is because it makes sense to me and it feels right, for me. I do have my reasons; even now, though, it's very hard to share them and to talk about it. I fear being misunderstood and judged badly for it, as has happened so many times before.