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#46
10-16-2011, 03:15 PM
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About returning back from the dead... oooh but wouldn't it be nice to have some samples!?  OK, some people come back from an NDE experience, & they said it was simply awesome out there... but all we get is a story. It's up to us believe it or not; everyone has the free choice. If say you knew this person before as a nervous, bitter, stressed-out, ever grumbling type - & after this sort of experience, the person is amazingly calm, almost serene, s/he stops worrying about trifles, but rather, tries to do everything in one's hand to make the world a better place knowing full well that not all the plans come true... Then we can say "we have a sample". Whatever happened during that experience, whether the person really had a glimpse of heaven, or it was an imagination, or a hallucination... What does it matter if the person changed for the best!(In fact... I am remembering a particular doctor who had gone precisely thru this change. But I don't know him personally. If I did I would have taken "before" & "after" photos or videos  )All said, I still prefer to believe in heaven, & I daresay I almost know what mine is like
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Knowledge is a chimera for beyond any knowledge there ever lies other knowledge that renders the previous knowledge false. (The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant, The Unbeliever Vol.II- Stephen Donaldson) What the bleep do we know!  I know only this: Eywa has taken me on a ride... ... the one I don't want come back from Last edited by apache_blanca; 10-16-2011 at 03:18 PM. 
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#47
10-16-2011, 06:09 PM
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If an NDE changes someone from a cynical bastard to a to a calm one with a new appreciation for live and the world, I'd be much more inclined to believe it was due to the sudden trauma of almost dying
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#48
10-16-2011, 06:26 PM
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Exactly. It isn't due to magic, it's due to not wanting to waste their life
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#49
10-16-2011, 06:28 PM
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Of course that can be the case at times, but far from all the time. OBE's come from other things than near death experiences too, and has had the very same effect.
A different perspective on life - in these cases, a spiritual one - can truly make a difference for someone's happiness. 
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#50
10-16-2011, 07:46 PM
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I know I faced it more than once, and... erm... well I don't know if it changed me that much*! Oh yeah it did - I give much less importance to some things that used to drive me mad. I just have to remember falling down from 1000m with 2 parachutes that opened at once due to some technical hickup & wondering if they would tangle & I was living my last seconds... they didn't tangle & the proof is that I am posting here. Altho... I don't really remember myself being a cynical bastard either! but I used to worry much more, this is true. (*but some other things certainly have played their part in changing my world vision. LIke meditations & other spiritual things )Added: I've thought it over, for the sake of statistics I almost died about 4 times, & I wouldn't say it changed me much as a person. But this parachuting thing was different: not exactly an NDE but yes it was a spiritual experience: in the sense that I was reading The Teachings of Don Juan that time, & he talks quite a lot about death. Briefly - the Death is always near & rather than ignore it, one will do much better keeping in mind that it can come any time - thus, one stops wasting one's life on stupidities & lives each day as if it were the last... a long etc. Then, if one respects Death, it can even become a friend & an advisor. In the worst hour of your life, ask: "Death, is it my time?" Most probably it will say: "Hmm... naaah! I haven't touched you yet. Go, play, rabbit". (Of course if it is your time... then the story is different): So when I was dropping with the two open parachutes this sermon suddenly rushed into my head & I thought: "It's time to put Don Juan's teachings in practice... Death! Is it my time?" (fancy having this sort of thoughts in this sort of a situation?) Death said nothing, or maybe I didn't hear. I decided that since it didn't say "no", neither "yes" it was best to put the panic in the waiting drawer & concentrate on the "task in hand" - i.e. the safe landing. So, yeah - I got a different perspective on life quite all right! Thank you Don Juan, I take my hat off, your Teachings do work for me! in theory & in practice .
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Knowledge is a chimera for beyond any knowledge there ever lies other knowledge that renders the previous knowledge false. (The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant, The Unbeliever Vol.II- Stephen Donaldson) What the bleep do we know! I know only this: Eywa has taken me on a ride... ... the one I don't want come back from Last edited by apache_blanca; 10-16-2011 at 08:53 PM.
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#51
10-17-2011, 01:48 AM
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#52
10-17-2011, 06:40 AM
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Quite a few people have become spiritual after near death experiences or OOBE, I wouldn't be quick to rule out some kind of contact with a spiritual force being responsible for the change. Spiritual/magic or not wanting to waste life..Neither is more right than the other. It's all to do with what you believe in.
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Always listening to The Orb: O.O.B.E...  My fanfic "The man who learns only what others know is as ignorant as if he learns nothing. The treasures of knowledge are the most rare, and guarded most harshly." -Chronicle of the First Age "Try to see the forest through her eyes." Réalisant mon espoir, Je me lance vers la gloire. Je ne regrette rien. (Making my hope come true, I hurl myself toward glory. I regret nothing.)
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#53
10-17-2011, 11:31 AM
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Suppose a person has a close encounter with death, and...
Option 1: nothing changes cos the person already believes him/herself perfect, wonderful & the best. Option 2: nothing changes apart from the conclusion: "Life is a bitch, & so am I". Option 3: the person reconsiders the way s/he has been living & some attitudes (like that doctor started to say "Hello, how are you?" to patients). Question: is it necessary to wait till Death gives one a flick on one's nose? Why not to start now? Option 4: a spiritual experience is involved, say, one sees one's life in perspective, & how Choice A lead to Situation B, scratches one's head, has a good think AND decides to change some ways & attitudes. Option 5: Other. Bottomline, I agree with all who say that it can be this, or that, or something else. Spiritual, and/or lust for life, and/ or ... (fill the gap). The more nice people on this planet the better for all - & hopefully Without having to face Death in order to become a wee bit nicer! "Let nobody be dead today - it will look very bad on my report!" I just can't help quoting Avatar 
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Knowledge is a chimera for beyond any knowledge there ever lies other knowledge that renders the previous knowledge false. (The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant, The Unbeliever Vol.II- Stephen Donaldson) What the bleep do we know! I know only this: Eywa has taken me on a ride... ... the one I don't want come back from Last edited by apache_blanca; 10-17-2011 at 12:13 PM.
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#54
10-17-2011, 01:05 PM
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There are many more people who have not, but those far more common occurrences are clearly not publicised.## Quote:
Of course, there is always "Person suffers stress/mental issues as a result" as well, which can cause behavioural changes.
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#55
10-17-2011, 03:20 PM
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I am very glad to see that most of the people agree about many possibilities, & each can believe in one which is more to one's liking!
Since it is a Spiritual forum... I prefer to believe in spiritual possibilities
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Knowledge is a chimera for beyond any knowledge there ever lies other knowledge that renders the previous knowledge false. (The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant, The Unbeliever Vol.II- Stephen Donaldson) What the bleep do we know! I know only this: Eywa has taken me on a ride... ... the one I don't want come back from
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