I see you?

[Taw Makto]

This thread is epic. Elevates respect for all here. Awesome. And I mean that very word, not the slang that's bandied about so casually these days.

[Woodsprite]

Originally Posted by Ay'iheyu

...do you think that it's appropriate in this situation to use this phrase when first meeting someone on ToS, or do you think that it is used too loosely?

Used too loosely. Absolutely... which is why I hardly use the phrase...

...and why I didn't say it to you or anyone I've ever welcomed on both AF or ToS. In fact, I don't think I've typed or written it out more than 12 or 13 times since I first saw the film.

[Mune]

Is it just me or am I the only one who pictured me with Neytiri at that last part lol and I've got to say I agree with a lot of what you just said except for the marriage part... marriage should exsist (you probably thought someone was going to bring that up again huh? lol) I don't know what your beliefs are and am not trying to start anything but for me marriage was created by God... but it goes much farther than "God created marriage therefor it's right" Marriage is the ceremony of bondage... like the Na'vi and their way of marriage pretty much is mating before Eywa. It's the lifelong commitment two fleshes that were made one will stick it out with each other for better or for worse (a lot of people seem to miss that last part)... its a vow that these two will live with and love eachother as long as they live and far beyond that... unfortunantly humans have screwed this up as well... the divorce rate nowadays is sickening... in the US 1/2 marrages will end in divorce. I've even heard teachers at my college say, "get married for money, not for love" and that being followed by a bunch of college kids nodding their head in agreement. Sorry if this got OT thats just my $.03

Naturally, I'd disagree Stanley, but of course I respect your views. Maybe I'm deluded, I don't know. I'm Atheist... And I'm writing a LONG essay to try and explain why I'm Atheist.. I was verging towards 'Nihilism' for some time which is like the 'vegan' compared to the 'vegetarian'.

Anyway! Thanks for responding.

[And no, you're not alone in thinking of Neytiri at the last part... I'd do anything to experience that with a girl who thinks similarly to me though... It'd be my life fulfilled, just to experience that brief moment....]

When welcoming someone, I tend to use Kaltxi instead because (as this whole topic would suggest) Oel ngati kameie is something that I personally believe should be reserved for a time when you really do See someone.

Yeah, exactly. I don't use 'Oel ngati kameie'. I've never actually used it in real life... I can say it to 3 people currently in existence. Those three will remain mystery though.

Mune! That is one of the most profound and beautiful explanations I have read about 'Oel ngati kameie' and mirrors completely what I am learning from studying Rumi~!

My grateful heart thanks you for sharing your insight!

Thank you, truly. I really appreciate that.

Wow, thanks for that paragraph, Mune. Very nicely written.
Yeah, I compared it to the japanese phrase "A i shi te ru". It means I love you but it's not something you use all the time. Something you might use more often in it's place is "Daisuki".

Thanks. I've never heard of that phrase :o

[Stanley_9875]

Originally Posted by Mune

Naturally, I'd disagree Stanley, but of course I respect your views. Maybe I'm deluded, I don't know. I'm Atheist... And I'm writing a LONG essay to try and explain why I'm Atheist.. I was verging towards 'Nihilism' for some time which is like the 'vegan' compared to the 'vegetarian'.

Anyway! Thanks for responding.

[And no, you're not alone in thinking of Neytiri at the last part... I'd do anything to experience that with a girl who thinks similarly to me though... It'd be my life fulfilled, just to experience that brief moment....]

I know and I respect yours too... I don't hate and I cannot judge. But I was just mentioning God made marriage, but I also followed that with, "because God said it so thats it" I didn't add God into the enxt part after that, because I didn't know what your belief was, and I tried to put it into why there still should be marriage, but I was also agreeing how sometimes people only marry for show, or because the other person has a lot of money, ect.

[josie20]

Well...anything I can say has already been said for the most part. I don't use "Oel ngati kameie". I mean, I've used it in response a couple times, when someone has said it to me first, just to be polite. But I've never felt a deep enough connection to use it and really mean it.

I guess, like any phrase, it could very easily get to the point where it's used too often. However, I think it is up to the personal user of the phrase to decide whether it is warranted or not. If they really feel it appropriate to use, then I have no problem with it.

I think it also depends on the person. Some people use "I love you" quite often, almost as if it were a greeting. I almost never use this phrase, but that's just because I was raised in a family that doesn't express verbal or physical emotion very liberally. We know we love each other, so we don't express it all the time.

It just depends on the person and the environment in which they were raised. If they are used to expressing such sentiments, I have no problem with it. But personally, I choose to save that phrase for a very special person at a very special moment.

[Stanley_9875]

Originally Posted by josie20

Well...anything I can say has already been said for the most part. I don't use "Oel ngati kameie". I mean, I've used it in response a couple times, when someone has said it to me first, just to be polite. But I've never felt a deep enough connection to use it and really mean it.

I guess, like any phrase, it could very easily get to the point where it's used too often. However, I think it is up to the personal user of the phrase to decide whether it is warranted or not. If they really feel it appropriate to use, then I have no problem with it.

I think it also depends on the person. Some people use "I love you" quite often, almost as if it were a greeting. I almost never use this phrase, but that's just because I was raised in a family that doesn't express verbal or physical emotion very liberally. We know we love each other, so we don't express it all the time.

It just depends on the person and the environment in which they were raised. If they are used to expressing such sentiments, I have no problem with it. But personally, I choose to save that phrase for a very special person at a very special moment.

Well thats another thing too... I love you... the english language is too... i think you know what I mean I can't think of the word... with the english language there is three different meanings of "love" and whenever I'm in a chatroom with some guys and girls I sign off with "I love you all" because I love them to the extent of close friends, even family. But Love also means something like how you love your lifemate, the deep connection love... see with the english language its hard to explain but I'm sure a lot of you understand

[madman]

The English language is one screwed up language!! I feel sorry do those of you tht had to learn it as a second language...

[josie20]

Originally Posted by Stanley_9875

Well thats another thing too... I love you... the english language is too... i think you know what I mean I can't think of the word... with the english language there is three different meanings of "love" and whenever I'm in a chatroom with some guys and girls I sign off with "I love you all" because I love them to the extent of close friends, even family. But Love also means something like how you love your lifemate, the deep connection love... see with the english language its hard to explain but I'm sure a lot of you understand

That's a good point, about the English language. I think the context of "Oel ngati kameie" should be decided by the individual and how they wish to use it.

Originally Posted by madman

The English language is one screwed up language!! I feel sorry do those of you tht had to learn it as a second language...

Same here, madman.

[Ay'iheyu]

Originally Posted by madman

The English language is one screwed up language!! I feel sorry do those of you tht had to learn it as a second language...

Seriously! I don't know how others grasp it. I know a couple of people who have lived here and spoken the language for a long long time and they still have difficulty with some things..

[Apollo]

Originally Posted by stanley_9875

i only use oel ngati kameie if i truly understand someone, i don't throw it around left and right... Another thing avatar taught me is to truly mean what i say (don't ask me how haha i have a reason just can't think of it at the moment...) but if someone here says something that truly relates to me or i completely understand them i use it... Plus also the na'vi use it as a greeting, but since they live in clans, they know everyone else very well

Originally Posted by madman

oel ngati kameie ma tsmukan

+1, I have only said it no more than 5 times.

Originally Posted by mune

....

Oel Ngati Kameie; the term is not abuseable,
namely because of it's nature. Typically, when 'oel ngati kameie' is compared with the human 'i love you'. The human version loses any potential meaning.... What also astounds yours truly about the na'vi term is that it has no gender, or particular level of social status attached to it... but 'oel ngati kameie' transcends far beyond 'understanding' into a level that for me, personally, is not even acknowledgeable in the slightest. I've said 'oel ngati kameie' to very few people. And all of them were within or part of the 'avatar forums' or 'tree of souls' community... However not before they have my 100% trust. 'oel ngati kameie' portrays a level of devotion that is strictly not understandable to anyone who does not see the world for what it really is- because in the end, all that we have is eachother. 'oel ngati kameie' is acknowledging the above fact, and almost thanking the person for being on the same priority of mind-set as you. You see, my dear reader, the problem with current humanity is that we over-look the fact that marriage is nothing more than a physical ceremony. Man's attempt to give physical proof to others that 'these two people are now together'. While as 'oel ngati kameie' bypasses that idea altogether. In my.. Very bias and probably very deluded opinion. Marriage shouldn't even exist - it's just another pathetic attempt by man to try and make a physical pact. It's almost like valentines day. Why show that you're together on one specific day, should the amount of time you spend defending eachother not over-rule any ceremony.... Where you're technically not doing anything for eachother at all. It's almost sad to think that the human race sticks by old principles in this case. We need to accept that words cannot portray everything. Certain members of the human race are at this level of realisation. Because of the fact that na'vi is not a written language. 'oel ngati kameie''s original creation must of been based purely upon a sound, that meant complete understanding of the situation at hand... Like many other phrases of the na'vi language... 'oel ngati kameie' simply cannot be described with words... That night under the stars with your soul-mate, where she's using your arm as a pillow, and snuggling up to you. Your body warm keeping eachother snug. And from her voicebox, the most meaningful words in reality grace your ear. 'i see you'. You then my friend, are one of the few beings within lightyears, that's felt true love within your soul.
----

I have the exact same principle. I never wanted marriage for different reasons, but marriage really is a loose term and can be seen more of as a joke. The rest of your paragraph is some that is relatable, truthful, and touching to me. It's kind of hard to find them people, guy or girl alike...