The "Imminent" destruction of humanity......

[Spock]

I will take any chance to promote my most recent blog. It took me a quite a while and I put a lot of effort into it. I would really appreciate it if you could take the time to read it.

http://spakey.wordpress.com/2010/03/...n-of-humanity/

Thankyou,

Spock

[Human No More]

I'm not so sure about global warming, but you have an excellent point with overpopulations and some people reproducing more than others...
Nuclear is the solution to energy requirements. Yes, it technically isn't renewable, but there is enough uranium to last for tens of thousands of years IIRC, and really, it's only a temporary measure until a viable fusion reaction becomes possible.
Interesting post though, I do agree with most of it.
PS. Great to see you on over here

[Sacred Tsahaylu]

The problem with uranium is that when it becomes depleted it is still radioactive. A great deal is spent disposing of it. But fusion is the way forward IMO

[rapunzel77]

Although you bring up some good points in your essay, I can't help but be disturbed by the attitude demonstrated in the essay on human beings. I might be wrong or I might be reading it wrong but it seems that you would like to see less people on this earth, less of what you call "dumb" people on this earth. What I find disturbing about this is the attitude that humans are not worth much. That they can be discarded and reduced since they amount to nothing more than trash in the eyes of some. In fact, this seems to be eerily close to what certain people, eugenicists believed in the 19th-20th centuries. It was the sort of belief that gave rise to Nazism and the final solution. This is why I am very disturbed by the overpopulation discussions that were going on in the AF forums.

I seem to be the only one disturbed by the attitude that it would be fine to let people in 3rd world countries starve and die since they are worth nothing apparently.

I know that there are many environmental problems. I believe there needs to be solutions to those problems but I also strongly believe they can be done with the attitude of love for all life, including human life since we live here too. I believe strongly that all life is a gift. All human life is a gift. We are all gifts to each other. The earth, the animals, plants, etc are also gifts to be loved and protected. Human beings should be regarded the same way. It is very sad that we have been terrible to each other. That we have shown hate instead of love.

We all have a free will. A free choice. It would be very, very tragic that in the name of saving earth, we would take away the choice of a person to have children because they weren't the "right" sort of people. This is a sad attitude.

I will probably be flamed for this. I don't know. I just find it so sad and I feel lonely on this board and on the AF because very few share this belief it seems .

[Iceri]

I enjoyed reading that blog, kudos.

IMO, the most likely event in which humanity takes a serious turn for the worse or a free fall into extinction would be economic collapse, global peak-oil, or a nuclear exchange.

[ZenitYerkes]

I have to say you're right and agree with you in many points, and about the human population I have to raise an important thing: the predator-prey balance. See, when there are too many predators preys begin to die out until there are almost none left, and the predators die of starvation. Then the preys' number begin to rise again,...

Humanity will get into a similar cycle. Once the resources regeneration process reached its top and there is no food for everyone, the agony will begin. A WWIII before 2030 could be expected with ease after this'd happened.

EDIT: Just read the text you put under the Overpopulation photograph; sorry for not seeing you already made this point before.

[Spock]

Thanks for your reply everyone.

Originally Posted by rapunzel77

Although you bring up some good points in your essay, I can't help but be disturbed by the attitude demonstrated in the essay on human beings. I might be wrong or I might be reading it wrong but it seems that you would like to see less people on this earth, less of what you call "dumb" people on this earth. What I find disturbing about this is the attitude that humans are not worth much. That they can be discarded and reduced since they amount to nothing more than trash in the eyes of some. In fact, this seems to be eerily close to what certain people, eugenicists believed in the 19th-20th centuries. It was the sort of belief that gave rise to Nazism and the final solution. This is why I am very disturbed by the overpopulation discussions that were going on in the AF forums.

I seem to be the only one disturbed by the attitude that it would be fine to let people in 3rd world countries starve and die since they are worth nothing apparently.

I know that there are many environmental problems. I believe there needs to be solutions to those problems but I also strongly believe they can be done with the attitude of love for all life, including human life since we live here too. I believe strongly that all life is a gift. All human life is a gift. We are all gifts to each other. The earth, the animals, plants, etc are also gifts to be loved and protected. Human beings should be regarded the same way. It is very sad that we have been terrible to each other. That we have shown hate instead of love.

We all have a free will. A free choice. It would be very, very tragic that in the name of saving earth, we would take away the choice of a person to have children because they weren't the "right" sort of people. This is a sad attitude.

I will probably be flamed for this. I don't know. I just find it so sad and I feel lonely on this board and on the AF because very few share this belief it seems .

Hey, I don't think human life is worthless, I admit I have lost alot of respect for humanity. What I do think is that human populations should be more based around what our habitat can offer up until our technology is good enough to give everyone worldwide a western quality of living. To attempt to solve the problems at this point in time is only inflating the problem (I explain why in my blog).

Sorry for sounding a little to 'efficient' but thats just how I come across.

Originally Posted by ZenitYerkes

I have to say you're right and agree with you in many points, and about the human population I have to raise an important thing: the predator-prey balance. See, when there are too many predators preys begin to die out until there are almost none left, and the predators die of starvation. Then the preys' number begin to rise again,...

Humanity will get into a similar cycle. Once the resources regeneration process reached its top and there is no food for everyone, the agony will begin. A WWIII before 2030 could be expected with ease after this'd happened.

EDIT: Just read the text you put under the Overpopulation photograph; sorry for not seeing you already made this point before.

Are you applying the predator-prey balance to resources? I'm not sure if thats a good idea as hydrocarbons take up to 30 million years to regenerate.....

But thanks for you input.

[rapunzel77]

[QUOTE=Spock;8372]Thanks for your reply everyone.

Hey, I don't think human life is worthless, I admit I have lost alot of respect for humanity. What I do think is that human populations should be more based around what our habitat can offer up until our technology is good enough to give everyone worldwide a western quality of living. To attempt to solve the problems at this point in time is only inflating the problem (I explain why in my blog).

Thank you for the clarification . I agree that we need to work with nature, not against it. It will be difficult to achieve but it is necessary because this current "civilized" bubble that we are in will not last forever.

Sorry for sounding a little to 'efficient' but thats just how I come across.

Yeah, that is how it came accross. Perhaps I should have read it more carefully. Thank you for the clarification though .

[fkeua vrrtep]

Mankind never cared for long-term effects , everything we ever cared for was gathering as much of what we consider wealth around us as possible , without any remorse and without taking care of our people .

mankind is built simple , if we face the truth (what we do not like at all) , we are greedy , we are selfish , we are ruthless .

Actually you could use quite a simple metaphor for mankind , mankind is gathering "burning" material around a fireplace and throws it into it to maintain it's "normal" habitat , we keep harvesting "burning" material until there is nothing left to "burn" , of which overpopulation is one reason for that to happen .

We simply tricked natures predator-prey system of regulating itself , today there's billions of us and at the middle or even until the end of this century there will be 15-20 billion people on earth , that's more than 2-3 times of our current population , and we are already struggling with our resources , how will we be able to manage such a huge population ? I say we simply can't , because earth only has a limited amount of resources , and a certain level of "comfort" can only be held if there is not that many people who want it .

Whether we will start controlling the number of children who are born , or nature will simply take over and do that job for us , may it be with diseases or other "natural" catastrophies .

If you look at the facts , at the way we are behaving , and if you predict that we will probably be even worse regarding to our behaviour towards our environment and ourselfs , we will kill ourselves one day and have earth transformed into a greyish, totally polluted dump somewhere in the nothingness of space , and that's a fact , I hardly doubt that mankind will ever overcome it's evil and ignorant nature , but we'll see .

[Spock]

Originally Posted by fkeua vrrtep

Mankind never cared for long-term effects , everything we ever cared for was gathering as much of what we consider wealth around us as possible , without any remorse and without taking care of our people .

mankind is built simple , if we face the truth (what we do not like at all) , we are greedy , we are selfish , we are ruthless .

Actually you could use quite a simple metaphor for mankind , mankind is gathering "burning" material around a fireplace and throws it into it to maintain it's "normal" habitat , we keep harvesting "burning" material until there is nothing left to "burn" , of which overpopulation is one reason for that to happen .

We simply tricked natures predator-prey system of regulating itself , today there's billions of us and at the middle or even until the end of this century there will be 15-20 billion people on earth , that's more than 2-3 times of our current population , and we are already struggling with our resources , how will we be able to manage such a huge population ? I say we simply can't , because earth only has a limited amount of resources , and a certain level of "comfort" can only be held if there is not that many people who want it .

Whether we will start controlling the number of children who are born , or nature will simply take over and do that job for us , may it be with diseases or other "natural" catastrophies .

If you look at the facts , at the way we are behaving , and if you predict that we will probably be even worse regarding to our behaviour towards our environment and ourselfs , we will kill ourselves one day and have earth transformed into a greyish, totally polluted dump somewhere in the nothingness of space , and that's a fact , I hardly doubt that mankind will ever overcome it's evil and ignorant nature , but we'll see .

You are quite right. Although technology may be able to save us, we will merely have to wait and see. Also, the earth will regenerate to a beautiful landscape within 1000 years of us being wiped out.

[fkeua vrrtep]

Originally Posted by Spock

You are quite right. Although technology may be able to save us, we will merely have to wait and see. Also, the earth will regenerate to a beautiful landscape within 1000 years of us being wiped out.

That's right , earth has alot more time than we have , that's something mankind has to become aware of , we are only guests on this planet , and we can disappear as quick as we came .

Technology COULD safe us , but becuase of costs it probably never will , why should industrials etc. invest in our future if they don't get any profit like into solar energy etc. , it's simply not "worth" it for them .

In fact , at least that's my oppinion , technology will be our demise , because we will become so addicted and dependent on it until we our so alienated from nature , that we simply don't care anymore , which will be the day of our downfall , there are already decisions being made about our future like about gobal warming and mankind fails horibly , so why should people change , and leave their little bubble of illusions and false ideals ? Well they simply won't , they'll sit there and watch the whole thing go down because nobody will act , mankind is lazy and people like to disappear in their own masses to lay down responsibility , just to be able to say "Hey , it was the governments fault/it was his/her fault !".

Mankind will inevitable dig it's own grave with it's actions if it keeps to it's ways , I think it will get alot worse before people even think about changing , but change mostly occurs too late , and so will mankind probably fail , before itself , even though we could make it ourselves alot easier , but if you look back at mankinds history , we have pretty bad cards in this game .

[Spock]

Originally Posted by fkeua vrrtep

That's right , earth has alot more time than we have , that's something mankind has to become aware of , we are only guests on this planet , and we can disappear as quick as we came .

Technology COULD safe us , but becuase of costs it probably never will , why should industrials etc. invest in our future if they don't get any profit like into solar energy etc. , it's simply not "worth" it for them .

In fact , at least that's my oppinion , technology will be our demise , because we will become so addicted and dependent on it until we our so alienated from nature , that we simply don't care anymore , which will be the day of our downfall , there are already decisions being made about our future like about gobal warming and mankind fails horibly , so why should people change , and leave their little bubble of illusions and false ideals ? Well they simply won't , they'll sit there and watch the whole thing go down because nobody will act , mankind is lazy and people like to disappear in their own masses to lay down responsibility , just to be able to say "Hey , it was the governments fault/it was his/her fault !".

Mankind will inevitable dig it's own grave with it's actions if it keeps to it's ways , I think it will get alot worse before people even think about changing , but change mostly occurs too late , and so will mankind probably fail , before itself , even though we could make it ourselves alot easier , but if you look back at mankinds history , we have pretty bad cards in this game .

Yes. That is why I had a point on "Can capitalism react fast enough"? I stated that it would be unlikely as fighting the issues would be unprofitable.

[fkeua vrrtep]

Originally Posted by Spock

Yes. That is why I had a point on "Can capitalism react fast enough"? I stated that it would be unlikely as fighting the issues would be unprofitable.

Yep ,doesn't it sound ridiculous ? "Oh hey , we won't put money into our future because it simply doesn't pay off for us".

Those people should be trialed for treason , it's a shame that we let a few people rule and destroy our planet and all we do is just watch .

Actually it's logic if you see it from their point of view , why should they invest into a energery source which is renewable and wouldn't costa thing because it's unlimited ? They can't tax it nor can they demand money for it in any other way , but from the devices which are needed to trnasform the energy , so they just stick to dirty energy like oil , gas , coals and electric energy produced with nuclear powerplants which are taxable .

I wonder what they will do if one day every drip of oil , every quantum of gas and every piece of coal to burn is gone , and the system will simply collapse because the drugs it needed to maintain itself ran out , I think at that point it won't be possible to go back and push renewable energy sources , because the whole system needed oil , gas , coals etc. to work , you can't just change it from now to then .

[rapunzel77]

Originally Posted by fkeua vrrtep

Yep ,doesn't it sound ridiculous ? "Oh hey , we won't put money into our future because it simply doesn't pay off for us".

This is the very thing that my husband has ranted about. He saw it happen in the 80's when they wanted to get rich quick so they moved jobs overseas, etc. Its all for short term profits with no thought about the future .

Those people should be trialed for treason , it's a shame that we let a few people rule and destroy our planet and all we do is just watch .

Agree.

Actually it's logic if you see it from their point of view , why should they invest into a energery source which is renewable and wouldn't costa thing because it's unlimited ? They can't tax it nor can they demand money for it in any other way , but from the devices which are needed to trnasform the energy , so they just stick to dirty energy like oil , gas , coals and electric energy produced with nuclear powerplants which are taxable .

Very true . Its sad because we don't have unlimited supplies.

I wonder what they will do if one day every drip of oil , every quantum of gas and every piece of coal to burn is gone , and the system will simply collapse because the drugs it needed to maintain itself ran out , I think at that point it won't be possible to go back and push renewable energy sources , because the whole system needed oil , gas , coals etc. to work , you can't just chance it from now to then .

All the more reason to start developing alternative energies now and to modify/change the infrastructure so that we will be adapted to it. Everyone knows that fossil fuels will run out eventually. This bubble of high-civilization will burst one day and it will be scary because very few people will know what to do .