Socialists Unite.

[ZenitYerkes]

My grandfather, who was a philosopher (I am following his steps), wrote a book called "The Mixed Democracy"; that purposed a system that implemented the best of both individualistic and socialist democracies. I believe it was and is still studied in some Hispanic universities.

If you know Spanish, take a look here

[Spock]

Originally Posted by stdout

I'm totally ignorant when it comes to history, so I can't comment on the merits or drawbacks of any particular system. Having said that, this looks pretty much the kind of society I'd like to live in.

The Venus Project

What do you think, Spock?

I like it, it is very similar to socialism too.

Originally Posted by rapunzel77

The question I have is, why are we stuck on this see saw? Why does it have to be socialism or capitalism? Isn't there perhaps other systems we can explore or even come up with something better than what has existed before? It seems that for over 200 years you had either one of these two systems (yes, I know that socialism/communism as we know it didn't start until the late 19th-early 20th centuries). Are these the best systems to have? Could there possibly be others? What do you think?

There are others, you just have to research them. If you feel up to it, you could formulate your own ideal and advocate for it. "Be the change you want to see in this world", in Ghandi's words anyway.

Originally Posted by Human No More

I think the best system is a balance of a free market, with some control and government programs. A complete implementation of either system is flawed to the point of unworkability.

Perhaps, but we would need alot more socialism to balance that out.

Originally Posted by ZenitYerkes

My grandfather, who was a philosopher (I am following his steps), wrote a book called "The Mixed Democracy"; that purposed a system that implemented the best of both individualistic and socialist democracies. I believe it was and is still studied in some Hispanic universities.

If you know Spanish, take a look here

Very cool, I have considered formulating my own ideals, maybe when I have the time. But socialist still advocates goals similar to mine, so I'll stick with that for now. I'm sorry I don't have an apt for languages.

[Woodsprite]

Not to be contrasting (I'm really not in the mood to get into this discussion), but... why is this stickied? No offense, just wondering.

[Spock]

Originally Posted by Woodsprite

Not to be contrasting (I'm really not in the mood to get into this discussion), but... why is this stickied? No offense, just wondering.

Because it is a place for people with a common view on world politics and economics to congregate and incite discussion, not to mention debate.

[Woodsprite]

Originally Posted by Spock

Because it is a place for people with a common view on world politics and economics to congregate and incite discussion, not to mention debate.

True, but the majority of us aren't socialists.

[Spock]

Originally Posted by Woodsprite

True, but the majority of us aren't socialists.

Since when was that a requirement for a sticky?

[Human No More]

A minority should never be able or allowed to impose their views on a majority who disagree.

Also, thread unstuck. I'm not being political when I say that this thread really doesn't deserve it, plus it looks like favouritism. Whoever stuck it, please tell me (PM) if you had a reason for doing it

[Fosus]

Originally Posted by Human No More

A minority should never be able or allowed to impose their views on a majority who disagree.

Are you serious? Weren't you the guy talking about freedom of speech in another thread?

Originally Posted by Human No More

thread unstuck ... this thread really doesn't deserve it

Here's the reason why this thread does deserve to be sticky:

Originally Posted by Spock

Because it is a place for people with a common view on world politics and economics to congregate and incite discussion, not to mention debate.

HNM, is it just because you disagree..? If not please tell me why this thread does not deserve it.

There's only one sticky thread in this section, having this thread as another wouldn't hurt.

[Davy Jones]

This thread is even named "Socialists Unite", it's not much of a debate; having this thread stickied would, like Human No More said, imply favoritism. And there really is no need to have it stickied.

The argument "There's only one sticky thread in this section, having this thread as another wouldn't hurt." is very irrelevant; since a forum doesn't need a certain amount of stickies.

[Human No More]

Originally Posted by Fosus

Are you serious? Weren't you the guy talking about freedom of speech in another thread?

Ok, reading that again, I misinterpreted what Spock meant.

Here's the reason why this thread does deserve to be sticky:

HNM, is it just because you disagree..? If not please tell me why this thread does not deserve it.

There's only one sticky thread in this section, having this thread as another wouldn't hurt.

You really question this just because I oppose total socialism as an ideology? (not even all socialism, just the kind that Spock promotes)

The truth is, this forum is for debates. If a thread like this is stuck, it makes it look like it's an official thread or view. As Xynth said, there's no need to have x stickies. The truth is, even if we did have to sticky a socialism thread, to avoid bias we'd then need one for every political view someone wants to promote.

[PunkMaister]

Socialists and Communists which are nothing but Socialists in a hurry will never understand the very basic concept of individual liberty, that's why any attempt from them to take over once more will only result in catastrophe. Heck it already is.

And here is a scoop of just what Individual liberty means.

[Spock]

Originally Posted by Human No More

Ok, reading that again, I misinterpreted what Spock meant.


You really question this just because I oppose total socialism as an ideology? (not even all socialism, just the kind that Spock promotes)

The truth is, this forum is for debates. If a thread like this is stuck, it makes it look like it's an official thread or view. As Xynth said, there's no need to have x stickies. The truth is, even if we did have to sticky a socialism thread, to avoid bias we'd then need one for every political view someone wants to promote.

Umm..... no it wouldn't. Socialism is a fundamental political and economic system, just like capitalism and communism, therefore it is one of the three major movers and shakers. If someone were to promote anarchy, then that shouldn't be stickied as it has little weight and argument behind it.

Originally Posted by Human No More

A minority should never be able or allowed to impose their views on a majority who disagree.

Also, thread unstuck. I'm not being political when I say that this thread really doesn't deserve it, plus it looks like favouritism. Whoever stuck it, please tell me (PM) if you had a reason for doing it

I can't understand your logic really.. maybe we should have debated over this through the PM feature first, don't turn into Lon. I beg that of you. You could avoid bias by stickying PunkMaister's thread that has an opposite point of view.

Originally Posted by Xynth

This thread is even named "Socialists Unite", it's not much of a debate; having this thread stickied would, like Human No More said, imply favoritism. And there really is no need to have it stickied.

The argument "There's only one sticky thread in this section, having this thread as another wouldn't hurt." is very irrelevant; since a forum doesn't need a certain amount of stickies.

You've completely missed the point, it has nothing to do with favoritism or the number of sticky threads, said thread has. What matters is that there is a specific thread for members to converse and share their views on the ideology in question. Even to challenge it. Unstickying isn't challenging.

Originally Posted by PunkMaister

Socialists and Communists which are nothing but Socialists in a hurry will never understand the very basic concept of individual liberty, that's why any attempt from them to take over once more will only result in catastrophe. Heck it already is.

And here is a scoop of just what Individual liberty means.

Capitalism has worked for centuries, but it can't deal with what is coming, I've explained this to you too many times. Further, socialism and communism are two very different things, please make sure you discriminate between the two of them. Also, most of what you've stated in your other thread is available under socialism.

Ok, so. HNM, just because you don't like socialism it doesn't give you any moral right to slow this thread down. Using arguments like we are the minority won't cut it because that is not a fact. To think so would be a logical fallacy. So lets put the mature pants back on please...

[Gunny]

I honestly dont think it should be stickyed, if you want a stikyed topic to as you say discuss the politics of things than have something such as "what political system would you choose and why" type of thread.

When you have something like this stickyed it bears the look of everyone here being sociolist and that it is an important thing for people to read to convince them to jump ships. This isnt a political forum, its an Avatar forum. Things that should be stickyed here are things important related to Avatar or forum changes.

[Human No More]

It's reasonable not to want something to look like it has official support, especially if it is political like this.

Originally Posted by Spock

If someone were to promote anarchy, then that shouldn't be stickied as it has little weight and argument behind it.

Sorry, but that's just hypocritical. It's a valid political view (not one that I subscripe to, but then neither is extreme socialism)

Do you really think that this thread will be 'slowed down' by not being a sticky? There really aren't that many threads in this subforum, and this one is possibly the most active one there.

You've completely missed the point, it has nothing to do with favoritism or the number of sticky threads, said thread has. What matters is that there is a specific thread for members to converse and share their views on the ideology in question. Even to challenge it. Unstickying isn't challenging.

Again, I don't see how having a normal thread puts you at a disadvantage. If I deleted or locked this thread without a good reason, yes, that would be admin abuse, and I really don't intend to do that, but returning a thread to normal status is not.

[PunkMaister]

Originally Posted by Spock

Capitalism has worked for centuries, but it can't deal with what is coming, I've explained this to you too many times. Further, socialism and communism are two very different things, please make sure you discriminate between the two of them. Also, most of what you've stated in your other thread is available under socialism.

Ok, so. HNM, just because you don't like socialism it doesn't give you any moral right to slow this thread down. Using arguments like we are the minority won't cut it because that is not a fact. To think so would be a logical fallacy. So lets put the mature pants back on please...

1. Not it doesn't Socialism and Communism is all about the collective, the group, the state not the individual. And the ultimate goal of Socialism is a classless State which is also the goal of Communism but through shock therapy if you will. Hence why people say A communist is a Socialist in a hurry.

2. Yes it can and just FYI corporatism and free enterprise are not one in the same because you constantly point out the flaws of corporatism which is in reality just another form of fascism/socialism.